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[dq409]

There is a thread on another site that says no early Chevys came from the factory with two upper control arms,,,not even the Z-11,,, Help me here....This guy says that he has talked to many people that worked at Chevy and they say the same,,,,dq

[jim_ss409]

I've got an article that says the ultra rare 61 SS 409-409hp (late production model)came with a re-enforced frame and second upper control arm.

[dq409]

Here is the link,,,,,I think he`s full of it,,,dq

http://www.chevytalk.org/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB13&Number=421252&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1#Post422020

[wrench]

I've never SEEN a factory two upper control arm setup in person.
I've only seen photos.
I've ripped SEVERAL single arm rear end housings apart on my 62.
I've seen the 1958 model year and it had a different type of upper control arm that had two mountng points on the rear end and one on the frame (my dad's Belair).

Or is that 4 cents?

:confused:

[Mark I]

Well dq, I do come here now and then, and I amended my post on the "other" forum, but after I did I saw it didn't change.

So I didn't mean to come off sounding harsh. But I stand by my story - as I stated there, I have talked to original owners, subsequent owners, several restorers, etc.

The Z-11 package didn't have it. I don't understand why that is so hard to beleive. The Impala HT that they were based on were much more the standard production car than anyone wants to acknowledge.

I'm just trying to shed some light on the truth, nothing else.

Thanks wrench for some back up on that.

Mark

[dq409]

Mark,,,,Didn`t take it that way . i just wanted more info as from what I have read and heard over the years is oposite of what you are saying.
Maybe I sounded harsh,,,,,dq :D

[wrench]

If the extra arm was an option, surely it's listed in the options catalogs. Nothing I have lists such an option. Anyone have a comprehensive list? If it was really an option the 61 SS 409 cars, then surely it would have carried over to the later years higher horsepower engined cars at least.

Was it on the 63 Impala Z-11 cars? Was it on any other factory Nascar cars of any year? (didn't the Nascar guys just get bodies in white anyway?).

Considering the amount of fabrication involved, one would think it would be a factory option, not a dealer installed option, but you never know.

I always thought it was a drag racing issue. (tearing the upper arm out of the axle or frame).

:confused:

I drilled the new bracket and frame for larger bolts. I think the bolt head size is now 15/16" instead the little 3/4". I did not add the other arm.

[SS425HP]

As far as I remember, the 61 409 cars were the only ones to get the second upper arm. I remember reading this again in some publication I have regarding the 61 09. It even had pictures as I remember. As for the Z cars, I have no recollection of that issue. I will say, that the factory left a lot of that stuff up to the racer. The factory never did offer headers. But, they knew every one was going to run them. I think this had to do with the 2" exhaust from the muffler back. You could run headers, but had to have the stock exhaust. 2" is lighter than 2 1/2". Wasn't going to make any difference with the headers open, except the weight. Also, remember we only were allowed 7" tires. We weren't ripping that stuff out on those tires. Now, with the 10-10.5" tires, it's another story. Hope this helps.

Fred

[SS425HP]

Hey, DQ, I have the picture you are using for your Avatar in an 8 1/2x11 framed photo! Easier to see that way! Shows the Thunderbolt getting beaten a little better!:D

Fred

[Mark I]

DQ, I took no offense to what you said, but you bring up a good point. A lot of what has been said and written over time has been "enhanced" somewhat.

wrench, I have three different dated Chevrolet parts lists, that list the Z-11 parts, they don't show anything to add rear arms, or anything really for the rear axle except gear sets. I don't have them here, but I believe they were dated Jan/March/May 1963.

I think Fred had it exactly right on the factory race cars - they left many things up to the racers themselves.

Mark

[dq409]

Like this???

[ss409cid]

Love it!!!!

[real61ss]

SS425HP,
I've never heard of a 61 409 having the 2 upper arms. Not saying they didn't, just never heard that. I have a copy of the April 1961 Hot Rod Magazine that had a article about the new 409. That article states that a heavy duty chassis could be ordered (LPO 1108) but that only included HD springs, shocks, brake drums, metallic brake linings and 15" wheels.
I think it would have been drag race thing cause the NASCAR racers were using the truck arm supension.

[dq409]

What bugs me is when I look at the way my second upper is installed,,,,you can`t tell the difference between it and the right one. If it`s not a factory install who ever installed has the same welding pattern as the factory.,,,,,,,,,,dazed and confuzed,,,dq