aluminum polish

[1958 impala]

HI GUYS
I HAVENT HAD A LOT OF EXPERIANCE POLISHING ALUM.AT LEAST SINCE MY HARLEY DAYS.IS SEMI CHROME STILL AVAILABLE?ANYONE HAD GOOD LUCK WITH ANY OF THE NEWER POLISHES?ANY SECRETS GOT A LOT OF POLISHING TO DO.:cheers

[Tom Kochtanek]

I have a similar question. I've used Mother's and some other over the counter aluminum posihes, and they seem to work OK. But in doing the anodized "spears" of trim along the side, they look good for a while, then quickly dull up. I don''t want to go through the expense of sending them off and having them anodized (do I?), so I'm looking for alternatives.

In talking about this with the owner of a chrome shop (that doesn't do the polishing I speak of) he recommended a product called "Extreme Polish" or some such item. Haven't been able to locate this as yet, but will ask him when I see him on Monday -- maybe he has some.

Let me know if you find viable alternatives that are successful :)

Cheers,
TomK

[bobs409]

From my experiences:

First, polishing annodized aluminum with a cleaner like Mothers, etc isn't going to do jack squat! :D You need to remove the annodizing, then polish the aluminum.

The annodizing is a protective layer over the raw aluminum. It can be removed with oven cleaner or there are products specifically to do this. Once that is off, the aluminum will polish to a mirror easily on a buffing wheel & compound or even by hand with Mothers, Blue magic or similar.



The problem now is that without the annodizing, the part is left unprotected. You either have to continually re-polish regularly or have the part re-annodized. Some even spray clear paint over the part but I doubt that would look good or last long. (never tried that)


I never heard of semi chrome but have had good results with Blue magic and Mothers mag wheel polish. There are many others too.


Im no expert on this subject but thats my experience for what it's worth...

[MRHP]

Has anyone tried zoops polish? They claim it is good for months and fills the pores of the aluminum to prevent oxidation. Just a thought.

[dq409]

Nows a good time of year to stock up on good metal polish !!

The indoor BIG Hot Rod shows !!

I bought some great stuff at last years show and it works fairly easy and has a finish cream that holds and protects the shine.

I`ll have to go to the garage and get the name for you.

Zoops,,???,,,,, Over priced IMO ,,,,

Doesn`t matter what you use you will have to keep at it. The stuff I have is a nice cream polish that is easy to maintain after you get the shine you want,,,,,dq

[Tom Kochtanek]

Bob, I fetched a backup piece of anodized door trim from my '62SS and located some oven cleaner and thought I'd try your recommendation. I couldn't tell from the label, but I'm pretty certain oven cleaner contains "caustic soda", or sodium hydroxide (NaOH, which is a base on the litmus scale). This stuff is good for removing grease and oil and caked debris on steel, but I think it's best kept away from aluminum. At least that's what the label says. Just for fun, I put some on an oxidized piece of anodized aluminum and washed it off in 5 minutes (after hitting it once with fine steel wool). Didn't do much, but then perhaps it takes more time -- at least it didn't mess anything up :)

Then I went through all the cans and bottles and found some "Aluminum Jelly", a Duro product, which is a division of the Loctite Corporation. It says it's specifically for aluminum, it's kinda like naval jelly (which is not for aluminum!) in consistency, and you can brush it on, wait five minutes (per instructions) and wash it off. It actually DID do something, although I'm not sure what. This jelly has phosphoric acid in it (other end of the litmus scale) and it leaves a sort of haze on the aluminum piece. It might be that it strips the anodization. Not sure.

Whatever happened chemically, I then wipe it down, dried it off and used some Meguiar's "Metal Restorer" on the piece. It shined up fairly nice, but it needs more polishing -- I just did it by hand. I hope to try another metal polish next, but that's all I had laying around.

So it sounds like DQ's process might be the track to take: use someting to strip the anodized surface, then polish it (by buffer if possible). I am not recommending any of these particular products, and am searching for recommendations for somethng that polishes best, then another for some kind of temporary sealant. I can deal with polishing the pieces once or twice year :)

Hope this adds some empirical evidence to the polishing venue!

Cheers,
TomK

[threeimpalas]

DON'T use oven cleaner on any aluminum pieces that are worth any $$$ to you. It will eat the aluminum. Speaking from experience on that (luckily it was a $2 hose end).

I've used the ZoopSeal on a set of polished billet aluminum rims and some other small aluminum parts. Seems to have worked as advertised on the rims. I imagine it'd hold up even better on trim pieces that don't see much road grime or other wear.

[bobs409]

I've done many, many pieces with the oven cleaner and it worked good for me or I wouldn't have mentioned it. It usually takes 2-3 15 minute soakings (or less) to remove the annodizing. Don't let it dry on the parts though. You'll know when it's off because when you test polish between soakings, it will turn the rag black. Then you know your down to aluminum.

I've spoke to many people about this in the past but this is the first time I've ever heard anyone say not to use it or that it damaged anything.

I better say, use at your own risk then, I don't want anyone to have trouble on my account. Or better yet, try a search for annodizing remover on the net. I know there are products specifically for this and perhaps will be better suited.

[Tom Kochtanek]

Bob, good suggestion!

I did a quick Google search and came up with some advise:

"Typical remover of anodic coatings on aluminum alloys is 20 g/L chromic acid + 35 ml/L phosphoric acid (85%) in deionized water at 90-100 C, which is able to completely remove the anodic coatings without damaging the substrate aluminum alloys. Immersion time depends on the coating thickness. "

This must be why the Alumium Jelly I used earlier tonight did something on those anodized trim pieces. Only I don't know the exact composition of the stuff, it does have phosphoric acid, one of the key ingredients above. Here is another suggestion (not mine, from a Google search, for what it's worth):

"You can remove anodize from aluminum without etching the base aluminum metal with the following solution:

22-28%/weight Sulfuric Acid (as Technical Grade, S.G.=1.84)
2-4%/wt Sodium Bichromate
Makeup - Deionized Water
Operate the above solution at 140 - 160 F. "

And an exchnage warning against the use of anything with caustic soda (sodium hyodoxide) on aluminum:

"I was told that sprayon oven cleaner will remove the anodizing from aluminum.

Barry Gallas

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By someone who didn't like you, Barry?
As far as I know, most oven cleaners are sodium hydroxide (caustic soda) and will attack the base aluminum just as readily as the anodized surface. It's probably not impossible to remove the anodized coating with oven cleaner if you have significant expertise, but an amateur applying it will destroy the part.

Again, these are not my words or experiences. Here's the source I am qouting from: http://www.finishing.com/2400-2599/2567.html

Hopefully if we keep experimenting someone will come up with some sound advise. Will keep you posted as things progress :)

Cheers,
TomK

[bbqcruising]

Solution. Send the six pieces to Butch's Trim shop in WI. Strip's the anodizing, polishes the pieces and reanodizes them. Never have to touch them again and they are correct for resto. Only about 600.00.:deal

[Tom Kochtanek]

BBQcruising:

I wish it was only $600, but by the time you add in the front grill, headlight covers, rear cove panels, license plate sections, hockey sticks and all the other aluminum pieces on these cars, that would really add up. If I was doing a show car (which I am not in this case) this would be preferred. Of course it will cost.

For my case, which is a fun driver, I might try to do some of these things myself and then maintain them over time. Plus I've been able to trick both my sons into polishing stuff, that it's fun and rewarding. Kinda Huck Finn-like, when he pretended to have fun whitewashing that fence :)

I've been practising a bit and think I can remove the anodized layer, and certainly I can polish the pieces (now watch me zing one off in to the distance with the buffer!), but am not sure on sealing them. Anodizing surely is the long term option, but perhaps there is some sealer that can substitute for that with shorter lifespans. I figure in the future I'll have even more time to putz on these sorts of things.

Thanks for the referral on the shop in WI. When I do the Bubbletop I may be going a bit farther with the correct long term restoration.

Cheers,
TomK

[tmracing62]

Well ..........

Simichrome is very much still available.
http://www.winterbrookfarm.com is one of many, many places to get it. Use a search engine and you'll find a bunch.

I put the final polish on miles of aluminum a year with a buffer, both on a stand and hand held. But if you have a lot to polish and not a lot of time, a polishing shop is a good place to start. Then you can fuss over your baby as much as you like to draw out the really deep luster. You can reduce the cost a lot by sanding as much of it as smooth as possible first. Especially on parts that aren't flat.

Polishing without some form of automation is torture and very inconsistent. It does develop enviable triceps though. If you don't have a stand buffer for big stuff, at least get an electric die grinder (Hitachi is real good for this) with anvils and buffs, some sanding drums and three grits of compound. Eastwood has some of this stuff, but it's everywhere.

Patience and preparation are the keys. Start with 600 grit on the DA. Then 1000. Then coarse polish. Then sand 1000 again. Then medium grit. Then sand 1500. Then ... you get the point. Up to 2000 grit. Use the buff rake after every 30 seconds of contact. Otherwise you're just polishing with compound and fine aluminum particles. Never do the work. Let the wheel do the work. Put the palm of your hand on the spinning buff. If it rips the bones out and spatters tissue on the wall - you're pressing too hard. Just kidding. It should just be brushing your hand while you hold it there and not blistering it. That's how hard to press against the buff. Period. If you want a finish that has as few microscratches as possible and makes each phase easier, then let the buff and compound do the work. Always buff in the same direction on flat parts. Not doing all of these things is why some guys get a good bright gray, but not a mirror polish and wonder why. When you can hold the part under a fluorescent light and only see minor directional haze from the buff, you're done and can then rub with a polish (mentioned below) until about when the Sun supernovas to get it perfect.

Also be prepared for a layer of dust and grime on everything in your life. You will look like you work in a coal mine and develop a strange desire to play the banjo. There will be buff yarn and black dust bunnies everywhere. Birds and spiders love the stuff. Wear goggles and a mask. Always have the buff pass over and away from an edge, not rotate into the edge so it can bite and sling the part. Maybe you can bench 350 pounds, but you can't fight the buff when it really grabs hard. I had a headlight rim break loose doing chrome, whomp me in the chest (OWWW), hit my custom orange pearl seven clear coats paint job across the garage and ding it down to the metal. This is not good. Don't mess around like that. Practice on raw stock. Be patient.

So maybe you will decide to work a few extra hours at Chip 'n Dale's to make the extra money to have a pro get you started right as well as avoid the equipment cost.

But no matter what you choose, I have gone through every coating and polish that works on aluminum that I know of - the more common and practical ones follow. If you want anodizing like those flashlights - Maglites - or like XRP AN fittings, you need to polish first, have it Brite dip anodized and then clear lacquer dipped. $$$$$$$$ Regular anodizing is sort of dull in color. Spray lacquers leave orange peel. A good auto painter $$$ does much better, but there is still sanding involved. Clear powder coat has serious orange peel, even with the new techniques. And they don't treat your work of art very gently and will seal any scratches under the coating and they do show through. Plus if threads are involved, the thickness of the coating does interfere so that has to be masked off.

ZoopSeal costs about $125 retail, covers about 60 square feet and you have to use the catalyzed mixture within two weeks and store it in the fridge. Running out one foot short or throwing it away makes you feel sick. It is a multi-step many hours process and requires your attention, but is easy. That said, it is a good product and keeps the surface from oxidizing.

Mother's and Meguire's et. al. are fine, but if you use LusterPad, you will never use anything else. DQ may have something like that that he mentioned and I am anxious to hear what it is. LusterPad has saved me hours of final spiff up and it really finds the gleam. You'll really like it.

http://www.lusterlace.com/pad.html

Long post. Hope it helps. Email me if you are really interested in polishing to this extent. There are lots more detail and tricks. It is possible to get a chrome like finish, but it's a pantload of work.

[dq409]

TM,,, EWE DA MAN !!!

I`ll get over to the garage today or tomorrow AM and let you know what it is I have,,,,

Have you ever tried a poly coat over the polished alum?
I thought about trying that on the next polish.

,,,,dq

[tmracing62]

DQ -

Do you mean something like Varathane (or however it's spelled)
or something else?

[dq409]

No,,, Varathane is a polyurathane,,,,, and no ,,, not Wesson oil either !! Thats polyunsaturated !!! hheee heee

A poly based wax.... like for car paint,,,,, It`s not really a wax but the same type of appilcation.

I have a mist application poly that I use on the Cadillac,,,,As good as it works I won`t use them on my older cars,,, Old school carnuba type guy !!!

BUT,,, the poly shines extremely well and it is a spray and wipe application with no rubbing in to speak of.
Just a simple wipe with a clean soft cotton cloth and a slight buff.

Actually this poly is one I`m learning to like extremely well !
It`s made by DWG International and called "Dri Wash`n Guard"

As I went to make a link I see they do make a Metal Polish.
Never tried it but my guess is it would work great for sealing and maintenence,,,,,,
dri-waterless-car-wash.com (http://www.dri-waterless-car-wash.com/store.asp)

Send for a free sample,,,,,,dq

[dq409]

O,,,,One more thing,,,I do use it in the engine compartment on the inner fenders and firewall. It doesn`t have the dust like a good wax !! The shine is unbelievable!!!

Dang,,,, I think I`m talking myself into liking polymers !!!

EAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

[tmracing62]

I know what it is and use it on the truck. I'm still trying to find something that actually protects raw polished aluminum from scratching. But, you gave me an idea - there are liquid polymers that settle flat - no brush strokes or orange peel. The problem has been they need specialized application equipment. But I know an organic chemist and think I know what I need him to figure out.

[1958 impala]

THANKS GUYS FOR ALL THE GREAT TIPS AND IDEAS NOW ITS TIME TO GET BUSY.:cheers