61 SS Revisited

[Bungy]

I decided to start another thread because the other was getting long in the tooth and I have a short attention span. Anyway, I just got back from looking at what was advertised as a 61 SS project car 4 sale $1000. It was 2 hours away but they only made 453 of them and I now have a noodle full of info on these cars. Well to make a long story short, $1000 will get you an SS grab bar and a totally rusted out basket case plain old Impala. Powerglide in trunk, no engine, no tach, no PS or PB, no dash pad, no trunk lid, No markings as to SS emblems ever been on quarters. Don't know how to tell if it had heavy duty suspension but it did have front sway bar. As far as sheet metal is conserned, you might be able to save the roof, hood and maybe doors. If anybodys interested email me and I'll give you the phone number. By the way. Their documentation that this was a real SS is that they talked to the original owner and he said it was real. OK

[bobs409]

As far as sheet metal is conserned, you might be able to save the roof, hood and maybe doors. If anybodys interested email me and I'll give you the phone number.


Sounds like a great deal! :D :p :rolleyes:

On that sway bar, I don't know about 1961's but for the 1963's, the 6 cylinder cars got a front sway bar but the V8's didn't. (I think) Wouldn't it be funny if that car came with a 6? :D

[Phil Reed]

Bob...on the sway bar ....you have it backwards. ALL V-8's had the sway bar and the 6 cylinders didn't.........with one exception!! The Z-11's did not have the factory sway bar. You can spot a V-8 car by the fact that the lower control arms had the bracket welded on for the sway bar mounting bolt.

[bubbletop61]

Bob...on the sway bar ....you have it backwards. ALL V-8's had the sway bar and the 6 cylinders didn't.........with one exception!! The Z-11's did not have the factory sway bar. You can spot a V-8 car by the fact that the lower control arms had the bracket welded on for the sway bar mounting bolt.

It is interesting the point you raise Phil. Canadian cars may be an exception to this, or 61 may be different. We bought a 61 BBTP parts car a year ago and it was a factory six PG set up, and really looked like it had never been messed with. The lower tables have those brackets welded on and a sway bar was there. Aubrey or Jim or Danny may have seen others like this.....????? It had beautiful one piece bumpers too.....I WAS DEEMED TO HAVE BEEN THE UGLIEST CAR EVER TO HAVE RIDDEN ON MY BUDDIES TRAILER :cheers Parts of rockers and quarters were blowing in the breeze all the way home, but the tunnel and lower cowl were perfect...go figure.

CHEERS,
Gar

[bobs409]

Phil,

My 63 says your wrong. My car was originally a 6 cylinder and it has the sway bar. I only heard the V8's didn't have one but don't know.

Somebody settle this before me and Phil go at it. :D (of course im kidding)

Oh yeh, my car is a Baltimore built car and I have most of the paperwork (enough to be certain it was a 6 originally)


Bob...on the sway bar ....you have it backwards. ALL V-8's had the sway bar and the 6 cylinders didn't.........with one exception!! The Z-11's did not have the factory sway bar. You can spot a V-8 car by the fact that the lower control arms had the bracket welded on for the sway bar mounting bolt.

[Fran Preve]

My 2 cents, 6's without V-8's with makes the most sense. Brackets on A frames seem to be standard (as in all had the brackets) rather than stock two types on the line. But all that's a guess.

[Impalaguru]

I got a 63 Impala 2dr ht parts car when I bought my 63 409 car and it was a 1 option car; two-tone paint. It was a 1700 series car, built in Janesville WI arround the middle of April and it had a sway bar. I had always believed in the no V-8 no sway bar rule until I saw this car. Could a swaybar have been an option available? Maybe a dealer added item? Would a 6 cyl car with HD suspension have had a sway bar? Taxicab, Police car? I still wonder about that car.
Ross

[bobs409]

Mine is a plain jane so I seriously doubt a dealer add on for mine. And no, it wasn't a taxi. :D

This is getting interesting though. Just like the dipstick post! ;)

[biscaynewagon]

Guys,

My Canadian built 1961 brookwood (original 6 cly. and 3 speed) also has swaybar installed, pretty sure is factory installed. Could it be a station wagon thing? Also came with 1 piece bumper at front and 3 piece rear.

Mind you though, I had 61 sport sedan (american car) same thing 6 cyl and 3 speed also has swaybar installed.

Maybe this is a 61 thing ? :confused:

[Bungy]

This crate I looked at was an original V8 as the vin started with 11837.

[1963]

Fran,Stick to impressing the NCOA. :bow
I do not know why Bob,s 1963 got a sway bar,but most all 1963 Belairs and Biscaynes 6cyl cars came without a bar and the control arms did not have the brackets welded on them to attach the links to.Sway bars could be ordered.Just a fact not my two cents.

[Phil Reed]

Maybe I might have to back off my statement earlier. I know from looking at cars, that all V-8's I've seen had sway bars. Now, I don't have any 6 cylinder cars here, but can't remember seeing sway bars on them. So, I went to the chevy parts bookand the listing is 58-64 Pass exc. Taxi & Police. There wasn't a listing for 6 cylinder cars. But years ago, I tried buying an NOS lower a-arm that did not have the sway bar bracket. I was wanting it for a customer doing a Z-11 restoration.

So.....guess the parts books don't back me up on this!!!??? :confused: :confused:

[threeimpalas]

I know the year in question regarding the sway bar is 1963, but my '61 Wagon had a dinky front sway bar and it was a factory 6 cyl/3 OD car. I'm fairly certain our '59 was a 6 cyl/3 spd car too, and it has a swaybar that looks the same as the '61. Don't know if it's factory or not though. Don't recall if the '58 Wagon that also has a 6 cyl/3 spd has a sway bar or not.

Why 6 cylinder cars would get sway bars, while 8 cylinder cars wouldn't is beyond me. Seems like it'd be dependant upon the suspension options rather than than the engine. That might help to explain why 6 cylinder wagons would get a sway bar.

[1963]

Phil,
1963 must have been the year a bean counter at Chevrolet discovered that they could save $5.00 per car by leaving the sway bars and brackets off most 6 cylinder cars.This was the case through at least 1967.I have converted a lot of 1963 to 1967 Belairs and Biscaynes to eight cylinder cars over the years, and I always had to change the lower control arms to add sway bars.This apparently was not the case with 1962 or older cars.I have had or have seen many 1961 and 1962 Belairs that were originally 6 cylinder cars and they all had bars on them.

[Gerry]

My 61 Bel Air left the factory with a six cylinder. No sway bar/brackets on lower A-arms.

[bobs409]

Could this be a Belair/Biscayne versus Impala thing? Mine is an Impala and has the bar.

Lets kick this around more. We may be able to add this one to the mysterious list just under 409SSdipsticks. :D

[MK IISS]

Bob:

It is a model thing. 6-cyl. Biscaynes didn't have the bar. I remember seeing the bar as an option in the order book. Can't remember what years though. Wagons may have come standard with the bar. I thought BelAirs had the anti-sway bar but apparently not. Every year when the new models came out my Uncle gave me the previous year ordering, sales info. etc. When I moved to FL I gave it all away.

Richard

[real61ss]

This information is from the 1961 spec's, don't know about other year models

Chevrolet Passenger Car spec.'s--- under front suspension, Dated Oct. 1960 states

Stablizer Bar-----
Material -- hot rolled steel
Dia. 0.6875
Usage --- All except 1111-69-21; 1311-69; 1511-69-37-39

in other words, standard on V8's, optional on 6's. It's also not shown as standard on the taxi cab equipment but is standard on the police equipment with either 6 or 8 motor

[dadz409]

This information is from the 1961 spec's, don't know about other year models

Chevrolet Passenger Car spec.'s--- under front suspension, Dated Oct. 1960 states

Stablizer Bar-----
Material -- hot rolled steel
Dia. 0.6875
Usage --- All except 1111-69-21; 1311-69; 1511-69-37-39

in other words, standard on V8's, optional on 6's. It's also not shown as standard on the taxi cab equipment but is standard on the police equipment with either 6 or 8 motor

I have the 1963 Chevrolet Technical data book from Chevrolet Headquarters Engineering Department, that's right their personal copy. Picked it up somewhere in the last 40 years.
It states in the November 1962 section page Chassis-3 as follows:
Application= all except 1100 & 1500-11 series, -69
this exception would be 2dr Bicayne 6 cylinder, 2 dr Belair 6 cyl, all 4dr sedans with 6 cylinder, 4 dr st wgn 6 passenger 6 cylinder and Belair 4 dr st wagons w/ 6 cyl and Belair 4 dr st wgn 9 passenger with 6 cyl.

In another portion of the data book it states as follows:
Application= reg equipment on V-8, provided on 6 cyl.
I think, after reading for 2 days that what they are saying is that the V-8's came with the sway bar, 6's didn't but could be ordered. It does not show as an option, so it would have to have been dealer installed.

I have the data book for 1962, but will need more time to look through it.
Make mine 409! Gary

[dadz409]

I have the 1963 Chevrolet Technical data book from Chevrolet Headquarters Engineering Department, that's right their personal copy. Picked it up somewhere in the last 40 years.
It states in the November 1962 section page Chassis-3 as follows:
Application= all except 1100 & 1500-11 series, -69
this exception would be 2dr Bicayne 6 cylinder, 2 dr Belair 6 cyl, all 4dr sedans with 6 cylinder, 4 dr st wgn 6 passenger 6 cylinder and Belair 4 dr st wagons w/ 6 cyl and Belair 4 dr st wgn 9 passenger with 6 cyl.

In another portion of the data book it states as follows:
Application= reg equipment on V-8, provided on 6 cyl.
I think, after reading for 2 days that what they are saying is that the V-8's came with the sway bar, 6's didn't but could be ordered. It does not show as an option, so it would have to have been dealer installed.

I have the data book for 1962, but will need more time to look through it.
Make mine 409! Gary

I'm back, 62 book was easier to find Chassis data. As follows:
Application= all except 1100 & 1500-11, -69 plus 1537

As you can see this is the same models as 63 with addition of 1962 Belair 2 door Sports Coupe with 6 cylinder engine. Regards, Gary

[Fran Preve]

'63: gee, whose right, you?. Seems like maybe your not.

[Fran Preve]

From 1961 salesmans brochure: Superlative ride "heavy duty rear ciol springs on Brookwood, Parkwoods and Nomads assure a comfortable ride and maximum load capacity. A stabilizer bar in front provides superlative ride and handling ability". Nothing is said about engine. Nothing is said under other body styles.
From 1962 salesmans car price and options: No listing for a sway bar as an option or one being included with heavy duty springs.

With the number of cars out there you would figure this is an easy question to answer.

[Bungy]

Maybe I'm reading this wrong but it seams to me that the info Gary posted from the 63 technical data books is exactly what 63 said. Most all 6cly came without but could be ordered.

[Fran Preve]

63: going back I believe I said it made more sense 6 without, 8 with and brackets on all, just what was your point?. For the sway bar to be dealer installed wouldn't the SMALL bracket on the A arm being on all make sense/, rather than stock both typs on the line.

[bowtieollie]

Bob:

It is a model thing. 6-cyl. Biscaynes didn't have the bar. I remember seeing the bar as an option in the order book. Can't remember what years though. Wagons may have come standard with the bar. I thought BelAirs had the anti-sway bar but apparently not. Every year when the new models came out my Uncle gave me the previous year ordering, sales info. etc. When I moved to FL I gave it all away.

Richard

See what you started Bob. :D

The tie goes to Richard for being "the most technically accurate".

The sway was standard on the Impala line, no matter
what the engine RPO.

Biscaynes and Belairs, only standard on V-8s. NOT optional at
all.

IF the car didn't have a bar - then it also didn't have brackets on the A arms - not unless crash damage was repaired with an incorrect part application.

This one you can take to the bank....... another 348-409 curiosity solved. :cheers

[MK IISS]

Ollie:

Well NUTS!! I thought I saw the bar as an option, somwhere, but I'm going on memory from 40 yrs. ago.

There was a goofy option on the 6cyl Biscayne called the ecomomy carburetor. The description stated: "not recommended for highway driving."

What if you had a hot date and the only motel was out of town?
(sorry... off subject)

[bobs409]

Thanks Ollie. That clears that mess up. :p You were waiting a little while to reply to this one weren't you? :D

Now, lets put you to the test...why does my 409 dipstick have SS409 stamped on it? :D :D :D

[CarlK60]

I just found this topic and see you got it cleared up already. But Ill just add I have a 59 and a 60 both 6cyl/Biscaynes in my presence, no bars, no brackets. Have 1 more 6cyl/Biscayne 59, but front suspension has been replaced/bar added. all other X frames here are V8s with bars. never knew an Impala 6cyl had a bar (also never tried to find out)...learn something new everyday :cheers No wagons here, Id always heard they all had it, but have no idea.

CK

[jester]

Bob...on the sway bar ....you have it backwards. ALL V-8's had the sway bar and the 6 cylinders didn't.........with one exception!! The Z-11's did not have the factory sway bar. You can spot a V-8 car by the fact that the lower control arms had the bracket welded on for the sway bar mounting bolt.

Was it the same way for the 64?

[59fins]

'63: gee, whose right, you?. Seems like maybe your not. :cuss




What's this all about? more play ground antics?