348 / 409 PRE 65 engine build

[Tic's60]

Ok oh great engine builders:-) Here's one for you. If you dare.
The challenge: Build either a 348 409 motor using only parts available to you prior to 1965. NO 396/427 or engines duplicating their cranks, pistons etc. They do not exist yet so neither does their specifications. Stock or HP parts of the time (except blowers) only, M/T, Moonies etc. 348/409 combo's ok, 1-8 carbs. Most will probably go after the big HP 409 heads etc but that's not much of a challenge :-) A low budget killer 348 with 409 heads crank makes a much bigger challenge.
Winning categories
Most HP
Most Challenging
Most Low Budget High HP Gain
Most votes wins

Think farm boy ingenuity!

[Tom Kochtanek]

A challenging idea! What is the time frame for completing such a project?

I am assuming that a 348 with a 409 crank is OK, but what about afternmarket pistons (such as those recommended by CPG)?

Cheers!

TomK

[Tic's60]

Aftermarket pistons would be fine. Your engine would be a paper engine, easy an cheap, using the http://www.virtualengine2000.com/index.htm Virtual Engine you would use it and paper. You can upload your specs for the dyno via a file and the rest on paper. Sound fun?

The main part is being able to use parts and machining from the pre 65 era. Hence NO 396 type parts or specs.Today we take the block down to the local machinest and after 10k we got one hell of a motor. But let's go back to the times when even if we had 10k we where limited to what was available then and there for a 348 / 409 racer and see what come out of it.

I bet allot of people would Love to hear how it was done or began than oh buy these 3000.00 set of aluminum heads yada yada.

Will anyone learn from it? Sure! I know I am trying to figure out how to get 450+ horses out of a 348 using nothing but stock or 60's era parts right now and many others out there probably are as well since the 409 is getting harder and harder to get.

Laters

[bobs409]

A challenging idea! What is the time frame for completing such a project?
TomK

You have 7 days. :D :rofl

[Tic's60]

that many huh :-) Race is in nine so that leaves some testing time :)

[SS425HP]

Stroked crankshaft was no problem. Weld up the far side, and regrind off center. Was done all the time. No need, today. Pistons were no problem. Was easier to get pistons for these motors then, than today. Every one made them. Same with cams. Parts were easier to get then, than today. Not sure you could get 450 HP from a 348, without a blower, but that was no problem, either. And, the kicker, it was way CHEAPER then.

Fred

[Fran Preve]

Fred: cheap is a relative term, take the price back then and multiply times 5.5 the increase in the CPI. That said, your right, as I've posted, I just got a huge collection of Drag News, a weekly drag newspaper out of California, and I've reviewing 61-64 right now. What you said is mostly correct, and while not cheap cheap the costs back then were somewhat lower.

450hp from a 348 is very difficult, and costly. Getting 550 from a 409 is the same (ask Aubrey!). Using parts available back then.

Bore a 348 out .060 and put on 690 heads and intake. Put in a good hydrulic roller cam, add headers. If you stroke it it's not a 348, and stroking a 348 is kinda dumb, just start with a 409, bore it .090 (it will take it) and put in an offset stroke crank for about 480 CID (like they did back then). If it's for the street put on 2x4's but cahnge the small necks for large necks, if it's for the strip put on ALgon injection.

tic if you want more detail I can give an opinion, and I'll use the parts available from whatever year you want and earlier. As far as HP is concerned, I'll use real horsepower, not "paper" horsepower, on a W block a computer sim is virtually useless because of the heads and combustion chamber.

[CDNpontiac409guy]

As far as HP is concerned, I'll use real horsepower, not "paper" horsepower, on a W block a computer sim is virtually useless because of the heads and combustion chamber.

Tell me about it, Fran. I tried a desktop dyno with the specs on my stocker engine. Even "tuned them down" a bit.
616 HP @ 6900 RPM.
I'll tell you, if it really did that, I could sell the blueprint sheet on the engine for $1000.00 a copy ;)

Aint gonna happen