cam eating

[johnnyrod]

Well I got my first cam eating and it sure was an ouch.I just had the heads redoneand ran it for half hour befor I noticed the nocking sound then it saarted to run rougher. I was wondering how long does it take to eat a cam. It was #1 cylinder intake valve. I am running a crane cam #150291. Oh well onward we go. John

[Ronnie Russell]

Sorry John, That is horrible news. Hope things go well , next time.

[dq409]

I was wondering how long does it take to eat a cam. It was #1 cylinder intake valve.

Not long ,,,EH? Bummer,,, been there and I feel for you,,,dq

[SS425HP]

Five minutes took my last one out. Check spring pressures and binding for sure. Try, key word, to make sure you know why it happened before you put another one in. Hope your filter got the metal. Good luck. Been there, done that. Not fun.

Also, read up on the oil info that has been posted here lately. There has been problems with flat tappet cams due to the oil not having enough zinc in it for cam break in. Get some GM EOS next time. Should help.

[dunhamfield]

I have read many threads that have discussed this problem so I thought this would be a good time to put my 2 cents in.
I have been told by professional engine rebuilders that they extremely overfill the oil and run engine at 2000 rpm for half an hour. This splashes large quantities of oil on the cam for break in. Then drop oil and refill to proper level.
I had planned on doing that today right after checking the coolant system:rolleyes:
I feel your PAIN

[johnnyrod]

Well as far as we can gather I had a used cam in the engine and I put about 3k on it then the heads I had where rebuilt by a butcher who put springs in with only 85 lbs seat pressure and 250 open. The newly rebuilt heads where done acording to crane cams specs on the cam I had. The new springs are 112 closed and 322 open. So we think this is the culprit. My oil pump is pushing 60lbs on start up so we will remove pan clean up the mess and go again.. That 327 is looking good I gotta tell ya. Yhanks guys hey dunham let us know how it works out with the oil bath. Oh ya I got a new cam from Crane the same one and a new set of crane lifters. John:grumble:

[5509]

sorry to hear bout cam going flat.322 is alot of spring presure.I am a firm beliver in GM EOS and a slight overfill. another way is to breakin with less spring.Keep RPM up for 30 min. don't idle motor.Hope this helps someway !! tom

[Tom Kochtanek]

Sorry to hear about your loss...

Think of it as an opportunity to dig inside that wonderful 409 again, and do some assembly :). Hoping that your second attempt is more successful, you've earned your badge already!

For what it's worth, I removed the inner springs on my double coiled valve springs for breakin purposes, then put 'em back in after breaking the engine in about 20-25 minutes. Might go to a weaker spring if you have singles?

Good luck in round two!

Cheers,
TomK

[models916]

2 quarts overfill is the norm on new cam break-in. Closed seat pressure 145 or lower on Hyd. should not be a problem. Crane lifter I assume, not the offshore imports. Crank splash is what it takes to lube the cam when new.

[MRHP]

While doing my cam brake in I added 2 qt oil while the engine was running. The oil I added floods over the cam and lubes and cools it. I have never lost a cam. I also use lubraplate engine assembly lube. I have done this foe 20 years.

[Ronnie Russell]

MRHP, I , too , have never lost a camshaft. HOWEVER, all this talk the last year about cams have me " running scared". Have ordered trans. and converter and hope to make noise soon. There are many precautions I take, but have never added extra oil. I was giving that some deep thought ( yep , that hurts ) when I read your post about pouring oil in right before initial start. Have been giving the technical stuff so much thought that I must confess, I would not have thought of that. So simple, flood the lifter valley right before start-up and oil has to drip on the cam . I work by myself, so I will have to recruit neighborhood kid to be designated ' oil pourer" AS eveyone knows, that first 5 mins. , there is alot going on and lot to check. I thank you for the tip, and will definitely use it.

[models916]

Ronnie, make sure you go in thru the valve covers. I pour a quart of oil mixed with STP (contains zink and is sticky) in each valve cover right before start-up. Never had a problem even with heavy springs.

[models916]

I like the STP product.




http://www.rlb.50megs.com/zincadditive.html

[MRHP]

I pour the oil in right after engine starts. Wait one minute and pour the other quart in. Hope it helps!

[johnnyrod]

I am useing crane lifters and cam Crane says to use their assembly lube to the base of each lifter. Is there another product as good or better to use for assembly? Thanks guys been a good thread. John:bow

[Ronnie Russell]

John, The Crane lube is good, but it is not enough protection. It is probably gone in a few seconds. The first 1 to 2 minutes is critical. Oil splash is the main source of lubrication, so these suggestions offered are a big help in ensuring oil to the cam quickly. Good luck....

[desapience]

There is no sicker feeling than when it hits you that a cam went flat on a first fire-up...

I've lost only one..., due to sping binding... The only good thing was that the builder ate the entire job, and replaced the engine with a totaly different block and heads, with a roller cam second time around (this was on a 468 BBC).

I kept the first block, rebuilt it again (with a flat tappet), and sold it, unfired -- and it's still running strong, in a friend's Camaro.

Oversight can be a female dog's best friend.

But, once bitten -- you learn good -- but, never again will you take those first 5-10 minutes of running a new engine for granted.

If you even think you've overlooked something, go back and check out everything thoroughly, before you turn the key.

Do not give up!

Denis

[Tom Kochtanek]

Many thanks for all the tips and tricks to consider when first firing up a new engine. I must have been somewhat lucky in that on my first ever "W" build all I had was an oil pan clearance issue, not a cam breakin issue. Next time I will be as careful and more so!

Plans are to assemble two engines at the same time this summer, and fire them up one after another. I'm sure something will go wrong, but that's the plan. Should happen in August, when I return home from travels. One is a Pontiac 428 (455 crank and heads) and the other is that "E 24 61" early 409 block with a stock crank and 1147 heads. I might have to get TomO in on this, he was a big help last time!

Cheers!
TomK