Block Casting Numbers ????

[WMWiest]

I have a 1963 Impala SS 409/425. The "block casting number" is 3830814. When I look at the chart on our website entitled "348/409 Block Casting numbers", it states that it was used in 1963 with NO mention of 1964. When I look in the book "Chevrolet by the numbers" 1960-64 by Alan L. Colvin, page 63 under "engine block identification", he lists both 1963 and 1964. Can anyone tell me which is correct??????........ W.M.Wiest

[Ronnie Russell]

WM, With all due respect to the book, 814 is 63 422 is 64....... I suppose there could be an over run into the next year.. The date code on your block would be a good clue. Should be a Julian date. 2 or 3 numbers..

[1958 delivery]

Exactly, whats the date on the block? The date should be reasonably close to the build date of the car, too much earlier and it's probably a 1963 block.

[oldskydog]

I think part of the confusion on these blocks is in the 64 Parts Manual the engine assembly or partial engine assembly shows the 814 casting for low performance (340 hp) application and the 422 casting for high performance applications. That may have been true for service engines/short blocks but I agree that in production the 814 was 63 and 422 was 64.

[WMWiest]

THANKS to "Ronnie Russel", "1958 delivery" and "oldskydog" for answering my thread! I'm not sure how to decode the "date code" on the rear of the engine block because, once again, I'm finding conflicting information. "3830814" appears at the top of the block and right below that number is "GM 4" followed by a "casting clock" which is approximately two inches in diameter and is composed of ten dots and one dot outside of the circle plus a screw head in the middle. I know this designates the shift at the foundry that produced the block. In the book by "Alan l. Colvin" (listed in previous thread), he states that this "casting clock" was used starting sometime in the 1964 model year on Saginaw blocks.
On the other side of the block (rear) are the letters "CFD" and below them are the numbers "353" which is apparently the "Julian Date Code". The chart on our Website indicates that these numbers show the block was cast on December 19 but doesn't say what year? In Alan Colvins book, he states that when decoded, this number means March 5, 1963 ? Therefore, there should not be a "casting clock" stamped on the block since they weren't used until sometime in 1964!
Very confusing so any help from you guys on exactly when my block was cast would be very much appreciated. The assembly date of my car is the second week of February (1963). Thanks again........

[Ronnie Russell]

WM, It would seem to me your block was cast Dec19 of 1962. This would be close enough to agree with your Feb car assembly date. Have you got a engine assembly date from the front deck pad? This would also be a clue. I cant explain the March date you posted.

[gearhead409]

Alan Colvin's books are good info. but they're not perfect. it's obvious that Alan didn't understand julian dates.

[Phil Reed]

WM, It would seem to me your block was cast Dec19 of 1962. This would be close enough to agree with your Feb car assembly date. Have you got a engine assembly date from the front deck pad? This would also be a clue. I cant explain the March date you posted.

Ronnie is absolutely right on!! The Julian dates started during mid-1962 for the 63 production parts. Therefore if your block is the original one..it would be a Dec. 62 casting date for your Feb 63 build date. I do not have any info on the "casting clock".

Ole Ronnie is right again!!!:clap :clap :clap

[oldskydog]

The clock was used to indicate the shift that cast the block.

[WMWiest]

Ronnie Rusell.....the engine assembly date or engine production code (suffix code) stamped on the "engine block pad" is "T 0108QB". Its my understanding that the T stands for Tonawanda, New York, the 01 for January, the 08 for the eigth day of January and the QB for 409/425 engine. Once again, nothing shows the year? I found that "QB" was used to indicate the 409/425hp engine in both 1963 and 1964 so that doesn't help! The last seven digits of the vin no. of the car are also stamped here which are "L167247" with the L designating Los Angles as the final assembly plant and the six numbers are the continuous sequence numbers of the car. What here shows the year? Thanks again.....

P.S. Phil Reed.....you mentioned that the Julian date code began in mid 1962 for 1963 production parts. Do you know how long it was used or when it ended?

[Ronnie Russell]

WM, Sorry, I dont understand what you are looking for. If you are looking for a number that says "1963", you will not find it. Your block was cast in Dec.62 , engine was assembled Jan 63 and intstalled in your car Feb 63. #814 denotes 1963. Now you even have partial vin number. You have it all. Dont know what else you need. You are a lucky guy, all the numbers match.

[impalaragpat]

Bill,
I know and have seen your excellent 63 at cruises and shows in and around STL.:bow Do you still have the Hurst shifter? If you are trying to make sure your car is correct in every way, Im pretty sure the Hurst shifter was never offered for the 63 as an option or from the factory. If im wrong I am sure to hear about it. Not putting your car down, just trying to help in your quest for perfection.

[WMWiest]

Ronnie Rusell..... to answer your question, I was simply looking for the date code and/or number sequence that designated the year. All the numbers and codes seem to show the month and day but not the year! I'm going to go with what you listed in your most recent thread as to the block casting and engine assembly dates (years). My friend, Mr. Phil Reed, seems to agree with you so thanks again for your help and drop me a note if you run across any further info.

P.S. impalaragpat.... you are correct, the "Hurst" shifter was not RPO factory item. I removed it and replaced it with the factory linkage and shift handle.

W.M.Wiest 409/425

[Jim G.]

At least someone said in this thread that there are changes in casting numbers in late and early production years. I have a '63 Implala built 2nd week July 63 and it has the original 340 hp 422 casting code engine with the VIN stamped. The car is fully documented and has not been on the road since '78, long before people thought about restaming.

Jim

[Ronnie Russell]

Thanks Jim for sharing that. We have always thought that a late production car could have the next years casting number, but it has been an opinion with no back-up. Now we have solid proof. A 63 car with a Dec engine casting would have to be cast in 62.WMWiest car would definetly have a #422 casting, so he can rest easy . I remember now that Mr. Wiest car was shown in a magazine last year. Super nice car.

[jim_ss409]

Thanks Jim for sharing that. We have always thought that a late production car could have the next years casting number, but it has been an opinion with no back-up. Now we have solid proof. A 63 car with a Dec engine casting would have to be cast in 62.WMWiest car would definetly have a #422 casting, so he can rest easy . I remember now that Mr. Wiest car was shown in a magazine last year. Super nice car.

Ronnie, you ment to say WMWiest's car would definietly have a #814 casting not a #422, right?

[Ronnie Russell]

JIm, Of course, I worded that wrong. Mr Wiest was unsure if his block was cast in 62 or 63. With the Dec. date, if it was cast in 63, it would have to be a 422. Since it is 814, it had to have been cast in 62. Sorry about the confusion. I knew what I was trying to say, just fouled it up.

[rstreet]

JIm, Of course, I worded that wrong. Mr Wiest was unsure if his block was cast in 62 or 63. With the Dec. date, if it was cast in 63, it would have to be a 422. Since it is 814, it had to have been cast in 62. Sorry about the confusion. I knew what I was trying to say, just fouled it up.

Ronnie...You had my head spining on that one just like when I don't read the question carefully like happened to me last week with the 4X2 linkage request.
Robert