0W30 oil.

61 Bubble

61 Bubble

Well Known Member
Ya, maybe the 20W50 was a bit thick, maybe there was another issue as I have seen gears taken out for lots of other issues. Once a guy was taking out a gear EVERY race weekend. Still I don't know why???

Try the 10 or even 5W30 FULL synth. IF you take out another gear, it's not the oil this time.
 
Fathead Racing

Fathead Racing

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 7
61 Bubble said:
Ya, maybe the 20W50 was a bit thick, maybe there was another issue as I have seen gears taken out for lots of other issues. Once a guy was taking out a gear EVERY race weekend. Still I don't know why???

Try the 10 or even 5W30 FULL synth. IF you take out another gear, it's not the oil this time.
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I'm looking into cam walk right now. Although I set the cam thrust when I first installed it and have a nylon cam button it still is thrusting against the flimsy sheet metal timing cover. This is a full roller valve train. The gears that were remaining on the distributor gear were showing quite a bit of wear upon inspection. So much in fact if I would have paid attention to this when I prepared the engine for the
Great Bend convention I would have replaced the gear. When I timed the engine upon replacing the distributor with the new bronze gear I did see the timing at idle seemed a little erratic. It looked like it would get more steady as the rpm's came up. I am not running big spring pressures so I don't know why this would be to much of a concern. I'm going to push a wooden shim between the rear of the water pump and the timing cover when I hold the timing light on TDC and see if this changes anything. I will add this. Research tells me that the dial back timing light also could be a problem as far as the timing seeming to jump around. It would be something to do with the light not with the ignition timing.
 
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Ishiftem

Ishiftem

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
See if the timing retards as you bring the rpm up to an honest 3-4k. If it retards more than a couple degrees then the cam is walking out to the front through either to much end play or flexing of the cover/pump. I had a problem with flex as my block pushes the cam out hard. Also had a nylon button which when removed was flattened and worthless. Makes sure you have something between the cover and pump so it is solid. The stamped cover will flex .020 with light finger pressure. If you take your intake off, you can verify what the end play is with everything bolted on using a dial indicator. End play should only be .005 - .010. Good luck!
 
Fathead Racing

Fathead Racing

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 7
1961BelAir427 said:
I would think if you have a strap across yours like that Ray, that it could not be walking still. ????? Unless there is a gap between the inside of the cover and your cam button maybe. ?????
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I didn't say I had the strap, just the shim lol. I haven't been running with a shim or the strap. Only thing I will do now is drop a wooden shim between the pump and the cover.
 
D

Don Jacks

Well Seasoned Member
Supporting Member 3
Ray.It's not uncommon for the timing to "dance" around at idle because of the weak springs in the distributor.The shim may not make a differance,but certainly won't hurt anything.Typically, I set the timing at whatever,like peak at 2500 on some cams,3000 on others,whatever the car likes for the best mph,and never even bother with the timing at idle.That's just me,but with the typical spring set up needed,it's very hard to read an exact setting,the best you can do is average it out.Since there's no real load on the engine at idle,it dosen't really matter.
 
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Fathead Racing

Fathead Racing

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 7
Don Jacks said:
Ray.It's not uncommon for the timing to "dance" around at idle because of the weak springs in the distributor.The shim may not make a differance,but certainly won't hurt anything.Typically, I set the timing at whatever,like peak at 2500 on some cams,3000 on others,whatever the car likes for the best mph,and never even bother with the timing at idle.That's just me,but with the typical spring set up needed,it's very hard to read an exact setting,the best you can do is average it out.Since there's no real load on the engine at idle,it dosen't really matter.
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I set my timing at 3000 rpm have been for years. My thoughts are like yours on the weak spring Don. Just looking for the "why" did my gear take a crap. I'm going to drop a wooden shim between the pump and the cover, just in case.
 
Ishiftem

Ishiftem

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
I don't think there is enough room behind a stock pump for that bar. I know I have less than a 1/16 between my edelbrock pump and the cover.
Ray, when everything was flexing on mine I had a lot of wear to the bronze gear. After tightening everything up it stopped.
 
1961BelAir427

1961BelAir427

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 3
Ishiftem said:
I don't think there is enough room behind a stock pump for that bar. I know I have less than a 1/16 between my edelbrock pump and the cover.
Ray, when everything was flexing on mine I had a lot of wear to the bronze gear. After tightening everything up it stopped.
Click to expand...
Very good point Dan. I've seen people weld a washer or shim to the inside of the cover for extra support too. Might be a better way to go with a stock style pump.
Instead of a nylon (or solid aluminum) button I use this style:
41KnsSHr9LL.jpg
 
Fathead Racing

Fathead Racing

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 7
I want to add, I have googled this phenomenon and have read many responses. You should see some of the nonsense out there that some are passing off as fact! This site is the best. I can't believe what advice is floating around. Just plain wrong and amateur. And this is on some sites that you would not suspect.
 
Ishiftem

Ishiftem

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
1961BelAir427 said:
Very good point Dan. I've seen people weld a washer or shim to the inside of the cover for extra support too. Might be a better way to go with a stock style pump.
Instead of a nylon (or solid aluminum) button I use this style:
View attachment 34003
Click to expand...
That's what I use. A tip I was given is to pack it with grease when the engine is assembled. I was told it takes a while for oil to get to it and they can be damaged before that happens.
 
1961BelAir427

1961BelAir427

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 3
Yep.....at a friend's suggestion I rubbed some of that red wheel bearing grease on it. I'm glad you mentioned it though Dan, because I had forgotten and would have probably installed the next one dry. :doh
 
Ishiftem

Ishiftem

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
Fathead Racing said:
I want to add, I have googled this phenomenon and have read many responses. You should see some of the nonsense out there that some are passing off as fact! This site is the best. I can't believe what advice is floating around. Just plain wrong and amateur. And this is on some sites that you would not suspect.
Click to expand...
upload_2015-3-4_18-53-58.jpegupload_2015-3-4_18-53-58.jpeg upload_2015-3-4_18-53-58.jpeg
 
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