409's in dragsters

Tony Salins

Tony Salins

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 3
Dragster

The trans is a powerglide type Dedenbear case with all after market HP parts. It was put together by a trans builder/designer that goes by the name Dr. Evil out of Schaumburg, Illinois. It has a Chrysler 83/4 rear with a 4:11 spool. The converter is an ATI 8" 4500 stall. Last year I used an old 800cfm Holley spread bore and to be honest it didn't work very good with the stock 400hp intake. I also used an old Mallory duel point distributor. This year we are going to use the new MSD billet distributor and a carb by Quick Fuel. I'm looking to keep the motor as stock as possible and still get into the nines. There are alot of younger racers that don't know what a "409" is, but we do our best to educate them. The older racers really get a kick out of the car.... they all seem to remember the dragster with the "09" and for us that is a big part of what it's all about!!! Thanks all of you for your comments. You made our day.
 
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Fran Preve

Banned
I hope you milled out the divider in the intake, they did that where it was legal, Chevy did it on the L-88, not needed on a high RPM motor only. 4.11 seems to low with your rear tire, what RPM are you carrying thru the traps?. Oh, I don't know, I'd do it different (and wish I did!), seems a shame that you have the start of a real neat combo, it's a shame to hold it back like you are. I know that a 409 like I described previously will take you into the high 8's, and still not be a grenade. The 2 bolt mains and (relatively) weak rods are weak points. I sure hope you studded the mains and re-did the rods with a REAL good rod bolt!.

PS: anyone thinking of going the 454 crank/rods route should be aware that your WAY overloading the weak 2 bolt mains, and there's no easy way around it. Only my 2 cents. Blocks don't grow on trees.
 
oil4kids

oil4kids

Well Known Member
Fast 409

Oh my my,

Throw the 800cfm Holley spread bore into the trash- they will never be like a normal Holley- Use a Barry Grant/ Demon carb it will wake up your 409, probably give you a 1/2 second.

I hope your not using the stock rods with even HD bolts they stink and also should be tossed I had explained this on a previous posting the cross section by the bolts is way to weak.

The arma steel mains are very strong and i doubt these are weak links when used with arp or sim. studs. They are just like the arma steel main caps in Big Pontiacs with 2 bolt mains and I have never seen a failure.

Keep up the good work !!!!!!!!!That rail looks great!
 
oil4kids

oil4kids

Well Known Member
yes

Fran

The BBC is a perfect replacement for the 409 but its longer by 0.135 so you have to use a special piston.
 
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Fran Preve

Banned
Thanks oil4, I thought so. The special pistons wouldn't be so bad, you need custom domes probably anyway, maybe a special bore size too. The rods would solve a major problem with the 09,besides which I have a few sets of dimples lying around. I don't like the Mk4 crank as I've said, it's not REALLY needed unless you want to stroke out to bigger cubes, I just feel it's too much added weight to put on the 2 bolt caps. Personally I'd rather stud the mains, run a stock forged crank, add the Mk rods and custom pistons and limit it to 7 MAYBE 7500 RPM. I think the combo I came up with would do 500/500 (hp/ftlb) and would put a dragster like Tony's into the low 5's/high 8's shifting at 7 and not straining the bottom too bad. But I'd do something I rarely if ever see, I'd run a T-350 with a .56 rear. Why?, I run mainly at an 1/8 track and would use 1/2 for that with 3rd coming in when I ran the 1/4. Maybe that's wacky, but I'd try it just the same. Tony's tranny is WAY overkill, but I understand he had it so use it. If my "plan" didn't work I could always drop back to a long tail glide. Sad, sad, sad, I've got a BEAUTIFUL set of ported and polished x race heads, a rough core block but I sold the 2x4 and 625 CArters and Hilborn, coulda, woulda, shoulda........................
 
oil4kids

oil4kids

Well Known Member
409 stuff

Fran

at the moment Im working with a 09 with a chevy 6223 forged crank, 6.385, bill miller rods and getting custom ross pistons
planning twin turbos to all go in a 64 Nova ala Harrell. The turbos were from callaway in old Lyme CT.

You may find it interesting that some of the guys at S&K Speedshop in the early 70s would weld up the mains of a 409 crank and stick it in a BBC. They would turn the motor 9000rpm with its short 3.5 stroke. I guess those 409 forged cranks were plenty tuff. I have the article if you want it posted.
 
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Fran Preve

Banned
No that's OK, good to know the crank is a good one, and GOOD luck with your project, sounds neat. I like the short stroke, big bore and long rod idea too. Thanks.
 
Tom Kochtanek

Tom Kochtanek

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 13
We haven't heard from Tony Salins for some time now. Not sure if he still is racing the 409 rail. I do remember seeing it at either Norwalk or Thompson some years back (seven?). I remember they wouldn't let Tony race, not sure what the reasoning was. I suspect Phil might have some contact info on Tony and his wife.

I did meet "wagon409" about 7-8 years ago. He went to twin BBCs in his rail (I think). I purchased his Dad's 1962 Belair back around then. It was White back then with a dual quad intake on top of a 1965 passenger block, stock stroke. It's now "BA 409" and has been set up as a drag car :). The 1965 engine went to a member here who was putting together a 1965 Impala "409 clone".

Best, TomK
 
409 lever

409 lever

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
there was a guy around here by the name of gus shmidt that ran 409 dragsters under the name "bootlegger'' back in the day. I have a 59 chevy apache that I am working on that belongs to his son dieter, he has a shit load of old 409 speed parts at their shop that his brother has put claim to after his dad passed away. I am trying to work a deal on a block for partial payment on his project, his brother has a all steel 34 ford coupe that is going to be 409 powered.
 
BSL409

BSL409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 6
dads409-jpg.3134470
 
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