4 speed Column Help

CASHguzzler409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 6
A friend has just finished restoring his 63 Impala, and is having trouble tearing up the
grease fitting boot and shoes on his upper shaft. His shaft measures 21" 1/4 from the
steering box to the special "C" clip that goes around the rubber boot. He thinks that the shaft is off by about 1/2", making something move and bust up the inner metal seal around
the 2 shoes. He's measured mine and its 21 1/4", I have had the same problem but it
was fixed with buying a new rubber boot with better inner metal seal's. He has rebuilt
4 -62 and 63 columns so he does know something about them.

Im not a mechanic, so my descriptions are not the best, but he is really at the point
of not knowing what to do? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Cash.
 

CASHguzzler409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 6
Still having same problem with upper grease boot and shoes pulling out of the metal container, especially when at a complete stop, and trying to turn the steering wheel hard to back into, or turn hard into a drive way. The steering shaft has been lengthened from standard length of 18-1/2 or so, to a +7/8 inches to make the steering rod long enough to put the nut on the steering wheel. But... it still isn't long enough, by about a 1/2", as when you try pulling up the shaft and tightening down the nut, it pulls the shoes out of the coupling, ruining the rubber & metal collar. Any ideas ?.... Can't figure out why the steering shafts need to be longgated to make it work?.... Really starting to piss Barry off... Any ideas...? sure would
be nice? thanks CASH.
 

blkblk63ss

Well Seasoned Member
Supporting Member 5
Did you lenghten the shaft? Weld in a section???:scared2 You can adjust the steering coupler (grease joint) assembly upwards on the lower shaft . There is a cup on that joint on the bottom to keep grease from running out. When I serviced my joint the flat disc kept falling out so I tack welded it in. You can mark lower shaft how far to slide lower shaft into joint . I think mine is about 3/4 inch .are you using stock lower correct shaft correct lenght.???
 

CASHguzzler409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 6
Yes he did weld in a section 7/8 " long to add to the original length of 18 1/2 or whatever the standard
shaft is. The shaft is still about 1/2" to short, as when he tightens up the steering wheel nut to hold
steering wheel on at the right position, it pulls the shaft up enough to pull the shoes far enough up the
grease cup to move it to the top, and finally when making a sharp turn when at a stop, it pulls the
coupling apart. So, he's going to weld another 1/2" to the shaft. Things just don't seem to add up
right. All 4 of his original 62-63 steering coluum's shafts are the same length, and all parts are original
or replaced. He's using a original manual gear box, stock 63 column. Just can't figure out why he
doesn't have enough length in the steering shaft coming through the cowl to put on the nut without
pulling out the shoes in the grease fitting.?.....
 

409gang

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 1
You got something else going on, there is no reason you should have to lengthen the steering shaft. If you have a 63 steering column it should work in a 63 Impala. I would do some serious measuring to see what is going on, 2 wrongs don't make a right.
 

CASHguzzler409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 6
Your Right, this is crazy, measured the frame before install steering box, there's no reason the stock
parts shouldn't work. yet when put together the shaft just doesn't come up far enough to get the nut
on the steering wheel. :tantrum:furious
 

409gang

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 1
Is your steering column mast in the right spot on the dash, sounds like the mast is up to far or you have the wrong lower shaft.
 

blkblk63ss

Well Seasoned Member
Supporting Member 5
Never add to shaft ,get another stock shaft ,,,period ...... Assemble column without the grease steering coupler connected to lower shaft . The short problem has to be in the lower shaft from grease coupler to gear box.
 

blkblk63ss

Well Seasoned Member
Supporting Member 5
Also does he have the rubber flex coupler at the gear box still on there ,if that is gone that would be the cause of short problem.
 

blkblk63ss

Well Seasoned Member
Supporting Member 5
Maybe someone could give you both stock 63 upper and lower shaft lenght to be sure you have correct shafts. I don't have lower shaft anymore since I went with a global west ps conversion which uses a different shaft lenght .It only makes sense that if a steering column has correct lenght shaft and is properly assembled with steering wheel on it it will fit in any 63 non tilt car.
 
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DonSSDD

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
Cash, post a pic of your steering column, steering box to firewall, you have something missing or wrong for sure if all parts are stock. Also post a pic of your column inside the car to make sure those parts are correct. I’ve had a 3 speed, 4 speed, and powerglide 63 columns, all the shafts and external bits are the same. I can dig out some pics later.

I can adjust my steering column too tight to the wheel, I have to loosen it just right to get it loose enough.
 

DonSSDD

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
So I have a 1963 Chevy 4 speed column in my Pontiac, it’s the brown one in the pics. When I got my car, it had a powerglide column and 605 steering so not sure what that did to my shaft length but I had a power steering box from a 62 and I used that when I changed my steering over to stock and installed the 4 speed Chevy column. I also got a bunch of parts when I got my 63, including a 3 speed column and a set of manual pedals (I removed them from a real rotten 2 door post 63 Strato Chief).

Everything was interchangeable between the 63 Pontiac and Chevy columns, except the metal bracket that goes under the column to fit it to the dash. All the parts had the same numbers and dimensions.

My 63 when i bought it with the powerglide column.

B3B69642-03F8-4DD4-978A-C677CC0DE104.jpeg
The black 3 speed and brown 4 speed column. The extra black bracket on top of the 3 speed is the base of a non stock wheel, likely a 3 spoke like in a 63 vette.

645F262C-C7BF-41B2-BE92-9324B8E19FCB.jpeg

74031DD6-B2A3-4756-9E47-5E159E5DAA32.jpeg
This is outside the firewall for the powerglide, from when i got the car.

3B6D359B-5D83-4600-B0A4-29A64C90BB67.jpeg

This is the 4 speed signal light housing, the red part with the green tape is the one from the 4 speed, the other part is from the powerglide.

DA12FB5C-5581-4F85-9FA4-AAF345CE299D.jpeg
 
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DonSSDD

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
This is a measurement from firewall to back end of the fitting, about 9 inches.

No problems at all fitting the wheel on.

I'd guess most of these dimensions and parts are the same as on a 62.

14586C63-F2D8-4820-A092-63882EC19025.jpeg
 
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CASHguzzler409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 6
Thanks for the great help, with the pictures and your description of parts, this just might be the problem.
Your showing me the difference of the 3/4 speed, gives me an area to check out. Barry had rebuilt
4 steering coluums, maybe in his putting them back together he mistakenly added the third part to the upper steering column, which would take away about 1- 1/2 " length. I'll check back with you as soon
'as I talk to him about it. thanks again. All the help is great on this forum... :appl
 

blkss64

Well Known Member
Still having same problem with upper grease boot and shoes pulling out of the metal container, especially when at a complete stop, and trying to turn the steering wheel hard to back into, or turn hard into a drive way. The steering shaft has been lengthened from standard length of 18-1/2 or so, to a +7/8 inches to make the steering rod long enough to put the nut on the steering wheel. But... it still isn't long enough, by about a 1/2", as when you try pulling up the shaft and tightening down the nut, it pulls the shoes out of the coupling, ruining the rubber & metal collar. Any ideas ?.... Can't figure out why the steering shafts need to be longgated to make it work?.... Really starting to piss Barry off... Any ideas...? sure would
be nice? thanks CASH.
So I have a complete 64 Impala SS TILT column, an untouched original and the intermediate shaft between the end of the rag joint area that bolts directly on to the steering gear to the other end is 18 1/2 inches long. The non tilt column intermediate shaft is longer. I don’t have that measurement handy but I know it is longer. You must have a tilt column intermediate shaft.
 

R63ss

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 4
63 shaft inside the column 36 1/4”29E24062-DE5C-4934-AAE2-74BA507E0DFE.jpeg
63 shaft with rag joint non tilt 21 1/4”
F0274CC9-CDFB-429A-9E2D-49868592D9B3.jpeg
63 shaft with rag joint with tilt 18 1/2”
8EF56643-A5D1-449E-8499-1DDDBAA01EDE.jpeg
If the shaft he has with the rag joint is 18 1/2”
I agree with the previous post that he has a tilt lower shaft.
 
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CASHguzzler409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 6
Anyone have one? 21-14" for sale, I have a 18-1/2 for trade or partial trade in?
Just checking, but the data you gave is wonderful, these are the things that
are very hard to find people that know this information. Tripple thanks... cash...:bow
 
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