A/FX
- Thread starter Dick MacKenzie
- Start date
George Klass
Well Known Member
Take a guy like Dick Jessie (photo above), an independent racer, like all of the Chevy racers, after GM bailed out of racing in '63. Would you build a legitimate (as in legal) Factory Experimental car or a Match Race Car? Remember, there was no factory support, no free cars, no free engines, it was just the individual racer and his own wallet. In many ways, NHRA made the decision for you, they "forced" you to go Match Racing. Here's how that happened.
he 1st NHRA National Event was in 1955, held in Great Bend, KS. The next NHRA National Event did not take place for a year, in 1956, held in Kansas City, MO. A year later (1957), the National Event was held in Oklahoma City, OK, then it was moved to Detroit, MI in 1959, and eventually, to Indy in 1961. So, from 1955 through 1960, NHRA held one National Event a year (and I'm not sure they ran a National Event in 1958).
It's important to grasp this. If you built a NHRA class legal race car, you basically had only one race a year where you could race it. Sure, you could (and did) race your car at your local or regional tracks, but many (or most) drag strips either didn't follow the NHRA Rulebook or had rules of their own. To tie up a lot of money in a car that fit the NHRA class rules might put you in a disadvantage at non-NHRA National events, where the track allowed modifications that did not follow the legal NHRA permitted mods, like removing the front bumper, moving the battery to the trunk, running drag slicks instead of a 7-inch tire, etc, etc.. Local tracks rarely enforced NHRA stock class rules with any intensity, rarely even pumped the engines to check displacement, almost never had a tear-down for the winner. After awhile, a lot of legal NHRA racers saw the light, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em. Believe me, it's not much fun to race your NHRA legal S/S Chevy 409 and get beat week in and week out by cars that you KNOW were not legal NHRA S/S cars, simply because the tracks did not mandate that requirement.
Now we come to 1961, an important milestone for NHRA. They held more than one National Event in 1961, the Winternationals was introduced in Pomona, CA that year. So now a legal NHRA car had at least two events he could race at. The next time that NHRA expanded their National Events was in 1965, when they added the Springnationals in Bristol, TN and the World Finals in Tulsa, OK. In 1962, the Factory Experimental Classes were introduced so in 1962, 1963, and 1964, you had a maximum of two events a year (Pomona and Indy) where you could race your "legal" FX car. What else could you do with it between the Winternats in February and the Nats in September? Well, you could match race it, and you could do that (theoretically) every weekend if you wanted to. You had to make a decision, you could take your "legal" FX car and race it twice a year at NHRA National Events (and get hardly any cash) or you could race it 20 times a year and make some real cash, and you did NOT have to worry about tear-downs or even keeping the car "legal". And better than that, you didn't need to have a legal FX car, you could "build your own"; you could buy a Nova or a Chevelle, stick in your own engine (with a stroker kit of course), and have some real fun and even make a few bucks.
For the independent Chevy and Pontiac racers in particular, this was hardly a decision...
he 1st NHRA National Event was in 1955, held in Great Bend, KS. The next NHRA National Event did not take place for a year, in 1956, held in Kansas City, MO. A year later (1957), the National Event was held in Oklahoma City, OK, then it was moved to Detroit, MI in 1959, and eventually, to Indy in 1961. So, from 1955 through 1960, NHRA held one National Event a year (and I'm not sure they ran a National Event in 1958).
It's important to grasp this. If you built a NHRA class legal race car, you basically had only one race a year where you could race it. Sure, you could (and did) race your car at your local or regional tracks, but many (or most) drag strips either didn't follow the NHRA Rulebook or had rules of their own. To tie up a lot of money in a car that fit the NHRA class rules might put you in a disadvantage at non-NHRA National events, where the track allowed modifications that did not follow the legal NHRA permitted mods, like removing the front bumper, moving the battery to the trunk, running drag slicks instead of a 7-inch tire, etc, etc.. Local tracks rarely enforced NHRA stock class rules with any intensity, rarely even pumped the engines to check displacement, almost never had a tear-down for the winner. After awhile, a lot of legal NHRA racers saw the light, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em. Believe me, it's not much fun to race your NHRA legal S/S Chevy 409 and get beat week in and week out by cars that you KNOW were not legal NHRA S/S cars, simply because the tracks did not mandate that requirement.
Now we come to 1961, an important milestone for NHRA. They held more than one National Event in 1961, the Winternationals was introduced in Pomona, CA that year. So now a legal NHRA car had at least two events he could race at. The next time that NHRA expanded their National Events was in 1965, when they added the Springnationals in Bristol, TN and the World Finals in Tulsa, OK. In 1962, the Factory Experimental Classes were introduced so in 1962, 1963, and 1964, you had a maximum of two events a year (Pomona and Indy) where you could race your "legal" FX car. What else could you do with it between the Winternats in February and the Nats in September? Well, you could match race it, and you could do that (theoretically) every weekend if you wanted to. You had to make a decision, you could take your "legal" FX car and race it twice a year at NHRA National Events (and get hardly any cash) or you could race it 20 times a year and make some real cash, and you did NOT have to worry about tear-downs or even keeping the car "legal". And better than that, you didn't need to have a legal FX car, you could "build your own"; you could buy a Nova or a Chevelle, stick in your own engine (with a stroker kit of course), and have some real fun and even make a few bucks.
For the independent Chevy and Pontiac racers in particular, this was hardly a decision...
George, you are sooooo correct!!
I for one, experienced exactly what you described racing between NHRA and AHRA tracks where rules became what some wanted them to be.
Overall, I have to say the local AHRA track was the most consistent.
I have watched at that track cars being torn down, CC’d, weighed, etc. pretty well run.
One track was a maybe not as “buttoned up” or created some rules as the winners were more local regulars
I can’t complain too much since I did get away with some rule bending of my own.
What frustrated me the most at almost any track was having to negotiate what class I would be in. Running a 409 with a Z-11 top could get you shoved in a stock class, an FX class or even a Gas class!!
The guys that classified you many times had no idea how to handle, arguing only made them mad.
B/FX was the most bizarre class they put me in. Did ok until it came apart
Note the water running out the headers
I for one, experienced exactly what you described racing between NHRA and AHRA tracks where rules became what some wanted them to be.
Overall, I have to say the local AHRA track was the most consistent.
I have watched at that track cars being torn down, CC’d, weighed, etc. pretty well run.
One track was a maybe not as “buttoned up” or created some rules as the winners were more local regulars
I can’t complain too much since I did get away with some rule bending of my own.
What frustrated me the most at almost any track was having to negotiate what class I would be in. Running a 409 with a Z-11 top could get you shoved in a stock class, an FX class or even a Gas class!!
The guys that classified you many times had no idea how to handle, arguing only made them mad.
B/FX was the most bizarre class they put me in. Did ok until it came apart
Note the water running out the headers
George Klass
Well Known Member
You are right, blk61. People forget that there were two separate "drag race organizations" going on. First, the "NHRA or AHRA organization" (I lumped them in together) that ran the National Events, and second, the "every drag strip in America organization". Many drag strips were independent, and not affiliate with either the NHRA or AHRA and even those that were, did not always follow the class rules laid down in the NHRA or AHRA Rulebooks. Lions Drag Strip in SoCal was an AHRA track and San Fernando Drag strip was who knows, independent maybe, I can't remember. And yet, the same cars that ran at Lions on Saturday raced at San Fernando on Sunday.
That's the other thing about building or modifying a car for Match Racing, other than the usual safety stuff, there were no rules, no tear-downs, no fuel checks, hardly even any inspections. I look back at all the Chevy and Pontiac cars (the non factory supported cars) that were actually built to be legal FX cars, and then drastically modified to be Match Race cars. I have always believed that NHRA dropped the ball on these kind of cars by pretending that they did not exist. Everyone knows that the term "Funny Car" came about as a result of the Altered Wheelbase 1965 Dodges and Plymouths, and since NHRA didn't want them, they became instant Match Race Cars. Soon, many non-Mopars were getting altered wheelbase modifications. NHRA could have created rules to accommodate those type of vehicles, allowing some wheelbase mods, engine set back mods, engine modifications, etc., but they didn't. In fact, NHRA did not introduce a Funny Car Class until 1969, long after the FX Classes ceased to exist.
That's the other thing about building or modifying a car for Match Racing, other than the usual safety stuff, there were no rules, no tear-downs, no fuel checks, hardly even any inspections. I look back at all the Chevy and Pontiac cars (the non factory supported cars) that were actually built to be legal FX cars, and then drastically modified to be Match Race cars. I have always believed that NHRA dropped the ball on these kind of cars by pretending that they did not exist. Everyone knows that the term "Funny Car" came about as a result of the Altered Wheelbase 1965 Dodges and Plymouths, and since NHRA didn't want them, they became instant Match Race Cars. Soon, many non-Mopars were getting altered wheelbase modifications. NHRA could have created rules to accommodate those type of vehicles, allowing some wheelbase mods, engine set back mods, engine modifications, etc., but they didn't. In fact, NHRA did not introduce a Funny Car Class until 1969, long after the FX Classes ceased to exist.
Several of the guys here know about this, but in 65-66 there was a 1965 Dodge A990 A/FX car I could never out run in Eliminations. It always looked stock and had a Hemi. Couldn’t out run it, so I bought it
Anyway, it was not until I bought the it did I realize that Dodge had moved the rear wheels forward 2” in the stock wheelwells!!!
No wonder it launched so hard!!
When the first car came off the line one of the Dodge engineers asked who had put slicks on it to make sure of clearances. Since no one had, he took it and mounted them. Nothing would fit, the wheel well in front of the back tire rubbed so bad they took a hammer and beat the lip and part of the wheel well in. One of the ways to tell a real car from a fake.
Anyway, here was an altered wheel base car out of the factory for supposed “street use” running A/FX at some tracks. The tracks had no idea what it was, trying to classify it stock when it came out and they never learned about the altered wheelbase!!
Crazy Days!!!
Look at the arrow in front of the tire below.
Anyway, it was not until I bought the it did I realize that Dodge had moved the rear wheels forward 2” in the stock wheelwells!!!
No wonder it launched so hard!!
When the first car came off the line one of the Dodge engineers asked who had put slicks on it to make sure of clearances. Since no one had, he took it and mounted them. Nothing would fit, the wheel well in front of the back tire rubbed so bad they took a hammer and beat the lip and part of the wheel well in. One of the ways to tell a real car from a fake.
Anyway, here was an altered wheel base car out of the factory for supposed “street use” running A/FX at some tracks. The tracks had no idea what it was, trying to classify it stock when it came out and they never learned about the altered wheelbase!!
Crazy Days!!!
Look at the arrow in front of the tire below.
Pat you certainly have brought back old "brain cells" with the restoration of that car. When I am in a bench racing beer session with the younger folks I always refer to that era Chrysler car as the years Chrysler got pissed off! Also during that era NASCAR Chrysler products were a force to be with. As a friend of mine who is still a local drag strip owner also says Chrysler helped create the match race era of run what your brung! He has told me stories of what was carried to his track in the match race wars. In my area he refered to some of them as running those Carolina Mountain motors that were created down south by the NASCAR engine builders. We all remember the match race 'Cuda that Petty Enterprises ran on the east coast.
Pat for your enjoyment here are some AWB's that I took photos of many years ago and a couple are even west coast cars that came east to get into the match money! Gosh I wonder where they are now?
Robert
Pat for your enjoyment here are some AWB's that I took photos of many years ago and a couple are even west coast cars that came east to get into the match money! Gosh I wonder where they are now?
Robert
Attachments
Ok while I have your attention for the "gear heads" here are some 65 era motors I found in my old photos. The turbo motor I have no clue whose match race car it was in. The blower motor was in Mr Norm's Grand Spaulding Dodge. Maybe Mike or other Chicago area people can give details. The Stage III motor I think was in O.B. Hewett's car sponsored by the Carolina area Dodge Dealers. I am certain many of us will remember their involvement in 60's racing. The Ford engine was in Phil Bonner's Falcon.
Robert
Robert
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Thanks for sharing ........awesome photos
George Klass
Well Known Member
From 1962 through 1964, the wheelbase of legal NHRA FX cars had to be OEM stock, just like for the S/S cars. In 1965, when Ford introduced the A/FX Mustangs, the wheelbase had been altered via a 2% body set-back. This was the same time that Mopar introduced the drastic body set-back Dodges and Plymouths (the "Funny Cars"). NHRA refused to allow these cars to run in the FX classes, but did approve a 2% body set-back for any car running in FX. Several factory supported Dodge and Plymouth teams were given second cars that they could modify into legal FX cars for NHRA competition. To my knowledge, the only Mercury Comet that was given the 2% treatment was Hayden Proffitt's, a modification that he performed himself.
Is it just me or is the blower motor sitting on a angle.
Dave
Dave
If that is in the Grand Spaulding, I can probably fine out what the deal is.
George Klass
Well Known Member
Yes the blower motor was a Grand Spaulding Dodge car. I was also asking about the interesting turbo car as I don’t know whose motor it was. I am certain the two motors were at York US30 in summer of 1965.
Robert
Bud Faubel’s Turbo Honker . . . a car waaayyy ahead of its time!
Robert, I got to thinking about what you said about Chrysler being pissed.
If you think about it, NHRA outlawed the use of aluminum for fenders,etc. after 1964. None of the sanctioning racing bodies were excited about the Hemi.
For 1965 Chrysler shipped the Dodge(100)and Plymouth(103) to LA to have them chemically milled(acid dipped), single pane windows, aluminum door hinges, no back seat, single wiper, van seats, not even a parking function in the AT transmission, no coat hooks, no door light switch or dome lamp and on and on. They did get mad and built something with incredible HP and light weight.
As a result many of these cars became additionally altered wheel base cars, blown and injected and the “Run What Ya Brung” was born then came the Funny Cars!
I never thought about the progression, too busy getting beat
Below is a photo of the body panels they had acid dipped.
Here is a photo of a friend of mine with his injected 426 Plymouth he built.
If you think about it, NHRA outlawed the use of aluminum for fenders,etc. after 1964. None of the sanctioning racing bodies were excited about the Hemi.
For 1965 Chrysler shipped the Dodge(100)and Plymouth(103) to LA to have them chemically milled(acid dipped), single pane windows, aluminum door hinges, no back seat, single wiper, van seats, not even a parking function in the AT transmission, no coat hooks, no door light switch or dome lamp and on and on. They did get mad and built something with incredible HP and light weight.
As a result many of these cars became additionally altered wheel base cars, blown and injected and the “Run What Ya Brung” was born then came the Funny Cars!
I never thought about the progression, too busy getting beat
Below is a photo of the body panels they had acid dipped.
Here is a photo of a friend of mine with his injected 426 Plymouth he built.