Bob Walla Delivers the First Aluminum 409 Block

jim_ss409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 5
Bob delivered a new block to us at Thompson this weekend!:beer

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It looks great! It has billet steel four bolt main caps and everything is built very strong but as you can see from the photo's it's quite a bit lighter than a factory block.
Bob also had a new iron block there but you won't see him carrying that one by himself. :scratch

We got him to build this aluminum block with BBC sized mains and cam tunnel. It's also drilled for a BBC pan and front cover. He can machine them to take regular 348/409 components but the BBC stuff works better for us.
We're not sure how many cubic inches we'll end up with. I think it might accept a 4.40 bore and a 4.25 crank will fit easily. That would give us 517 ci. Anything in that range will be fine for us.
The iron blocks will take a bigger bore, at least 4.50 but maybe 4.60 which would be good for 565 ci using a 4.25" stroke.
We'll use this block to build a new engine for the Pontiac. I'll start a build thread on that as soon as we get started. The plan is to have it ready in time for next years race season.:beer
 

61BUBBLE348

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 11
How much weight does the whole assembly save, would it be 200lbs or more ?

Carl looks like you need one of these !!.

cheers
 

chevytaylor

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
Good question Grub, I would think at least 180lbs (80-90 kg) or so.

Yeah, I sure do man:beer
 

yellow wagon

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
So cool!!! Can't wait to see it all finished and how many cubes you end up with :beer Looking forward to the build thread
 

jim_ss409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 5
So cool!!! Can't wait to see it all finished and how many cubes you end up with :beer Looking forward to the build thread

I'm not sure about the cubes yet. I'm guessing about 517 ci. :scratch We'd like to get as many cubes as possible but we don't want to max out the bore and end up with thin cylinder liners.
We're sure a 4.25 stroke will fit but a 4.375 might also fit. There are a lot of options but the 4.25 stroke crank is very common and therefore less expensive. Our engine guy is very good so we'll take his advice for a lot of this stuff.
I'm thinking the weight savings would be 100 lbs max. My guess is more like 75 lbs but even that is quite a bit.
We let Bob take the block back with him for final decking and line honing, then he's going to pass it directly to our engine guy, so by the time we get it back it'll have a crank and pistons.
Maybe bob will get a chance to weigh it and let us know how heavy it is.:deal
 

tripower

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
Very cool...:bow Are the iron blocks ready to go and what is the cost for one of them?
 

61belair348

Well Known Member
I saw the block out there and was very impressed. Given the quality of your work and the consistent performance of your cars, I would not expect this one to disappoint come next year.
 

jim_ss409

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 5
Very cool...:bow Are the iron blocks ready to go and what is the cost for one of them?

Don't quote me on this but I think the iron blocks will be about $3,500 and the aluminum will be about $5,000
I think Bob only did two or three castings for starters and I think they're in being machined right now, but I think those ones are already spoken for.
Now that the casting and machining process has been figured out I'm guessing he'll be able to start pumping out blocks reasonably quickly.
My guess is the iron blocks will sell in greater numbers than the aluminum. The bigger bore and lower price should make them more popular.
I think Bob can build the iron block as a direct replacement for the factory block, so it could take all the stock 409 components. But he can also machine it to accept BBC components. It's hard to say which version would be more popular. Of course either version would be much stronger than a factory block and come standard with four bolt mains.
Being a small operation I don't think he's going to want to build a whole pile of blocks at once unless he gets some solid orders.

I was just thinking that it was about five years ago that a few of us were sitting around at one of the 348/409 get togethers. This was at Clay City Kentucky.
At that time there was hardly any aftermarket parts for these engines. No stroker cranks, no Edelbrock heads or manifolds and certainly no blocks.
Bob had been talking to some guys and said he thought he might be able to get some heads made and maybe even a block. Skip ahead five years and he can finally say he got them both done.

By the way, Bob also cast a few sets of aluminum exhaust manifolds. (I think jim409_pontiac might have bought the last set):scratch We'll have to machine them ourselves and they'll go on Jim's Impala. It'll be interesting to see if they work OK. That'll be a winter project.

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Tom Kochtanek

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 12
Bob will know best, but I think I overheard that the aluminum block weighed around 100-120 pounds without the sleeves. So maybe 120 with the thick iron sleeves?

I would say Bob Walla himself weighs about 120 pounds dripping wet, and that's with his blue jean jacket sleeves :)

It's a pretty impressive collection of aluminum parts, that is to be sure!

TomK
 

Fathead Racing

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 7
Bob will know best, but I think I overheard that the aluminum block weighed around 100-120 pounds without the sleeves. So maybe 120 with the thick iron sleeves?

I would say Bob Walla himself weighs about 120 pounds dripping wet, and that's with his blue jean jacket sleeves :)

It's a pretty impressive collection of aluminum parts, that is to be sure!

TomK

Bob may weigh a little more than that, but he is one of the biggest men I know.
 

BULLET WITH A BENCH SEAT

 
Supporting Member 1
With his iron block, his heads and my intake...Im going for 1000-1200 hp. Probably 2 years out, but Its on the drawing board. Oh yeah...thats at 412 cubes...spinning the blower...all 09 components...running on methanol...a true 09. Im at almost 800 with a 2 bolt block and iron 690's.
Me and Bob are on it big!!!
 

58 Apache

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
:clap That first pic of Bob with the block and the Pontiac is really a shot for the future of the 409. Wow is that a nice piece guys.
 

BULLET WITH A BENCH SEAT

 
Supporting Member 1
I believe you'll do it!:deal
That iron block should hold that power with no problems.
A lot of Hemi owners will stand back when they hear that monster run.:beer

The HEMI guys stand back at the sound of my Max Wedge...and for good reason.
Especially if we get those ports raised in the new heads to flow over 400. Im getting to work on that as soon as I get a casting from Bob, and get in touch with Dave Mills. My sheet metal blower manifold will be very easy to modify for the raised ports and it already out flowed any head you would ever put it on. Plus I'm shoving the air in to boot. I will go for 22-24 psi on the blower, that should hit the 1000hp...( with a new cam). 15-16psi got me just over 760, with the old cam, and it should equate to about 25hp for each pound with the correct tune, plus I will be shooting methanol on top of that.

This is gonna be fun!!! or tragic...one or the other.
 

yellow wagon

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
Just a question but why not go with a turbo? Obviously plenty of unit that will support 1200-2xxx HP. I think Bob's block and heads will be what the market needs to build some REAL big HP motors. I would just LOVE to see a blow-thru carbed 500+" W motor with an 88mm on it and all the supporting parts make 1,400hp or more :brow
 

BULLET WITH A BENCH SEAT

 
Supporting Member 1
Just a question but why not go with a turbo? Obviously plenty of unit that will support 1200-2xxx HP. I think Bob's block and heads will be what the market needs to build some REAL big HP motors. I would just LOVE to see a blow-thru carbed 500+" W motor with an 88mm on it and all the supporting parts make 1,400hp or more :brow

Well for me its 2 things. I think the older cars look better with a big huffer sticking up over the hood. I look at turbos as newer tech and my car was built kinda retro.
2nd...I already have a Buick Grand National with a 249 stroker going in this winter. Its 800hp, so I know what the turbos are capable of. You wouldnt want to try to drive an 88 in a street car. It spools like crap. A 70 is massive on the street and still makes 975hp on a V6. I'm running a 66 and it makes enough for me.
Oh, did I mention...I drive my cars on the street...1000hp or not. It should still be pretty mild even at a grand, and Im running a 4L80E tranny.
 
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