Sleeving a 962 block

[Tom Kochtanek]

I've got a 962 casting 348 block from late 1963 with the ArmaSteel caps and reinforced webbing that has one bad hole. My local shop checked it out and was not happy with future prospects. They stated that the crack went all the way down low and that a sleeve is not the solution. I generally take these to Tony Schaffer for sleeving, but is this one worth saving?

Take a look at the pics and let me know what you think.

Cheers,
TomK

 

[petepedlar]

I'd sure try and save it Tom...... I'll show the picture to Jim and see what he says about a sleeve.

Dave

 

[oldskydog]

Tom,
If that one doesn't sleeve, I have another one just like it that needs 3 sleeves, but they aren't cracked all the way to the bottom like that one. Free to anyone that wants to come get it.
:

 

[region rat]

Tom, Sleeve makers suggest using less press to repair a cracked cylinder. They use a sealant to help but recommend a pressure check when done. Not sure if that would work when the crack goes all the way down. They might need to weld the crack first. Hope it works. Bob

 

[boxerdog]

It might be worth sleeving, doing a short block-fill, then testing prior to any cylinder finishing...sure seems like it warrants the effort. Just my .02.

 

[buildit]

Sleeves

Most sleeves are installed with about .001 to.0015 interference fit, with a register just above the base of the cylinder for the sleeve to seat against. If the crack extends beyond where this register needs to be, the block is usually considered to be not repairable. You can see that the crack would just continue on, because of the pressure of the interference fit.
What this means is, it is not economically viable to repair it. There are ways to repair it, but it would cost much, much more than another 962 block.:eyebrow

 

[Tom Kochtanek]

Cap swap?

If, as BuildIt suggests, that this block is not repairable, then would it make sense to "transplant" those ArmaSteel main caps onto another 348 block and use the (after line honing) for that application? I have that 1961 FH block that I'm trying to determine what to do with, maybe the mains can be used there?

Cheers!

TomK

P.S. How bad is it when a block's most valuable component are the mains?

 

[hogmotors]

Has Tony looked at the block Tom?

 

[Tom Kochtanek]

Not yet

No, Day Automotive is a ways down the road (100 miles) and I haven't had the chance to zip over there as yet. I'm generally in that area every now and then, so perhaps in the future. I guess this block isn't going to be built any time soon...

Best,
Tom

 

[Bootleggerjim]

What Boxer said.......short fill, use green locktight, good as new

 

[johnnyrod]

OK guys whats a short block fill?

 

[w ogden]

I am with Johnnyrod on this one also. What is this and how is it accomplished? How expensive can this be?

 

[rstreet]

ok I'll make this the number 3 request for a definition of short fill blocks
robert

 

[Dick MacKenzie]

There are a number of block fillers. Here's one.

According to the manufacturer:

"Hard Blok is a specially formulated, cement-based material that provides maximum strength, vibration dampening and heat dissipation required in high-performance race engines. Also extends cylinder wall life both by preventing cracked walls and by causing the walls to wear truer, honing is minimized during rebuilds. Remains stable at all operating temperatures and does not soften when exposed to high heat and will not erode under water."

 

[SSpev]

hard block is used to fill the coolant passages. no coolant no street time
"short fill"
use hard block half way up. basicly to the bottem of the freeze plugs.
I've been told you can run on the street, but limited.
I would suspect you need the rest of the systom in tip top shape

 

[boxerdog]

I have done even "shorter" fills than the bottom ff the freeze plugs, but that's a good reference point.

Since most of the heat originates at the top of the cylinder, the only real issue is the loss of coolant capacity which can be made up elsewhere in the system. I think my "filled" W runs cooler than my unfilled one. It definitely influences the size and shape of the bore, so it ideally is done prior to finish work. Just my opinion, however, I know many of you guys have put together a lot more engines than I have.

 

[buildit]

Short Fill

We used to use a "short fill" when the cylinders were bored beyond what was considered safe, so as to stabilize thin cylinder walls. It needs to be done prior to final machining of the bores.
As far as cooling goes, it usually is not a problem for lightly loaded street cars. Some customers said that their oil temps were a little higher, it seems logical as the bottoms of the cylinders would be a little hotter.
As far as the block being good as new, all the short fill will do is keep coolant from seeping into the crankcase, at least for a while. It will not repair the crack. One more thing, the short fill does not last forever, it eventually weakens and begins to break up.

 

[Richard/SIA]

"Short Fill" more street capable with reverse flow cooling?

"Short Fill" more street capable with reverse flow cooling?

Just thinking outside the box, possible way to save cracked blocks? :