1962 Chevrolet Sport Coupe Z11 409 "Light Weight"

[George Klass]

"There were somewhere between 18-21 Impala 409/409 cars built right at the end of the 62 production built with aluminum fenders, inner fender liners and hood."

I have heard this before, and it brings up an interesting question. NHRA Stock classes were required to run vehicles that were factory production line assembled. I would assume that the majority of Chevy S/S (or SS/S) drag cars in 1962 were using the 409/409 engine combination, as that is the way the cars were built prior to the Summer Nationals. And then, 18 '62 Chevys were factory produced with the 409 blocks and the new intake manifolds, and the new cylinder heads (the Z-11 heads) along with the aluminum front ends. Did these cars race in the NHRA Stock class? And if they did, what was the class designation, as they would have a huge advantage over the 409/409 combinations? Or, were they required to run the cars in the FX class instead of the Stock class?

 

[Don Jacks]

Most likely F/X and match race.

 

[W Head]

I raced a lot at Hobbs N M back in the day when living in Odessa, Tx. Saw Dick Harrell race there a lot. One week end there he was in his black 62 and the next week end there he was in his black 62 with a Alum, front clip.

W Head

59 Impala 409-2,4s

 

[Blk61409]

I raced a lot at Hobbs N M back in the day when living in Odessa, Tx. Saw Dick Harrell race there a lot. One week end there he was in his black 62 and the next week end there he was in his black 62 with a Alum, front clip.

W Head

59 Impala 409-2,4s

Yep, Dicks 62 with the aluminum is in Amarillo, saw it a couple of months ago.
Meanwhile, the 18 or so factory produced 62’s with aluminum front ends only had 409/409 engine. None of those received the Special Service Package 2 piece intake, heads and valley cover.
Guys like Dick and Hayden received their parts in crates. Hayden told me he received the new top half first and about 10 days later a crate with the aluminum.
The 18 or so were built in advance to determine how the coming 63 RPO Z-11 would be produced. The parts shipped to the drag racers were done so to win races.

 

[427John]

Weren't they initially in Optional/SS then something called Limited/Production before A/FX?

 

[George Klass]

Weren't they initially in Optional/SS then something called Limited/Production before A/FX?

Optional Super Stock (OS/S) was used at the 1961 NHRA Summer Nationals, not 1962...

Limited Production (L/P) was used only at the 1963 NHRA Winternationals...

 

[Barry Taylor]

Weren't they initially in Optional/SS then something called Limited/Production before A/FX?

Not sure of exact date this was taken but my guess is September of 63!

 

[Blk61409]

Not sure of exact date this was taken but my guess is September of 63!View attachment 118201

Barry, I love the State Inspection sticker on the windshield for street driving LOL LOL!
Oh by the way, I knew John Witt the owner of Friendly Chev. Later he was involved in other brand dealerships.

 

[Barry Taylor]

Dan Dean did the communications work with Bill Thomas to get dad the car and John Witt of Friendly Chevy signed of on it to purchase the car and give it to Dad to race. As you know Pat, the car had to be in Dads name. Dad didn’t actually buy the car until he was through racing it.

 

[63 dream'n]

Dan Dean did the communications work with Bill Thomas to get dad the car and John Witt of Friendly Chevy signed of on it to purchase the car and give it to Dad to race. As you know Pat, the car had to be in Dads name. Dad didn’t actually buy the car until he was through racing it.

Sorry Barry if I haven’t kept up …….but what ended up happening to your fathers Z11……..???

 

[427John]

My bad I was thinking OSS ran into 1962, so there was no class for those cars and the 1962 Ford 406 LW Galaxies to fit into for 1962? Wasn't the Limited Production class the precursor to FX?

Not sure of exact date this was taken but my guess is September of 63!View attachment 118201

So after the 63 Winternationals?

 

[Barry Taylor]

Sorry Barry if I haven’t kept up …….but what ended up happening to your fathers Z11……..???

I believe it was one of the ones that Pat was referring to that the fellow from Ft. Worth had scraped.

 

[Barry Taylor]

My bad I was thinking OSS ran into 1962, so there was no class for those cars and the 1962 Ford 406 LW Galaxies to fit into for 1962? Wasn't the Limited Production class the precursor to FX?

So after the 63 Winternationals?

If I’m not mistaken I thought i had a picture somewhere that had O/LP on the window but haven’t found it. “May have dreamed it”

 

[Barry Taylor]

I was wrong on the date the picture was taken! It ran in the Garland Daily News on Sunday April 14th 1963.

 

[George Klass]

OS/S in 1961 was a "quicky class" created by NHRA to deal with the optional engine parts that the factories provided to some racers just prior to the 1961 NHRA Summer Nationals. In the 1962 NHRA Rulebook it states: "All cars in stock classes manufactured after June 1, 1961, must be factory assembly-line produced and generally show room sales available." This statement was NHRA's way of notifying the factroies that componentnts that were NOT avaialble on January 1st, were not permitted in the stock classes. Factory Experimental did not exist until the Winternationals (the first NHRA event in 1962). By 1963, NHRA informed the factories that "Legal" stock cars must be produced in quantity and available to the general public on new car dealer showrooms (The minimum quantity was 500 vehicles if I remember). The cars with light weight components were initially never manufactured "in quantity", nor were they avaialble to anyone that wanted to purchase them off the show room floor. This was very impactful to General Motors, as the "no racing" ban was either in effect (or about to be). Chevy and Pontiac were hard hit as they were both manufactured in very limited quantity. Ford and Mopar continued to manufactured their light weight Super Stockers until the minimum 500 were built. However, 500 had NOT been built by February 1963 (the date of the 1963 Winternationals), but soon after, had met their minimum quota and raced the lightweights for the rest of the season in S/S class. The Z-11 option and the Swiss Cheese Pontiacs were originaly concieved by GM as S/S legal cars. In fact, all of the ones that showed up at the 1963 Winternationals were originally classified as S/S legal, until NHRA stepped in to re-classifiy the cars as Limited Producion (L/P). They could run in the L/P class with the 7-inch tirers or FX with drag slicks.

1963 NHRA Winternationals. Note the class designations (LP/S) on both cars.


Also at Pomona for the '63 Winternats. The two white patches on the car cover the original S/S classification.

 

[George Klass]

NHRA had more than their share of problems in the early 1960's with Stock car classifications. Some of the problems were NHRA's, and some were caused by the automotive factories themselves. The NHRA Rulebooks came out before the drag racing season begins (I'm referring to NHRA National Events), and the rules are to be in effect for that year. The early NHRA Rulebooks (I have all of them from 1958 through 1965) never mention anything about a "miniumum quantity", nor do they mention that higher performance factory components cannot be added after the first of the year. The factories wanted their highest performing products to be seen by the public at NHRA National Events, and NHRA wanted to keep the factories happy as sponsors of these events. Not always an easy marriage. And to keep things simple, classifiactions such as SS/S. L/P, O/S, etc. had to go. Personally, I feel that the introduction of the Factory Experimental classes in 1962 was a smart way of dealing with the so-called "factory assemly line manufactured" issue. The funniest part is that in 1962, none of the F/X class cars were actually built at the factory or on the assmbly line. You have to remember, NHRA held only one National event (the NHRA Nationals) until 1961, when the NHRA Winternationals were created at Pomona. Drag Strips around the nation could develope their own classifiaction rules, even if the track was santioned by NHRA. Technically, the rules for the FX class (along with other Stock classes) were only used at NHRA National Events for the most part. Building a legal FX class race car and running it at only one or at the most two NHRA events a year was a dumb idea, which soon was the start of the "run what ya brung" classes at drag strips all over the nation, or what I call the "Glory Years of drag racing".

 

[Skip FIx]

When I dropped a valve in my 409 about '73 Friendly Chevrolet had a "fitted block" still in parts,, but it was a truck block with the big notch so i passed on it.

 

[George Klass]

The one constant in the NHRA Stock classes, from S/S to N/S (or what ever) is that the classification of a particular vehicle is based on shipping weight divided by the advertised horsepower rating (per the NHRA Classification Guide). In my opinion, the wheelbase should also be part of the classification. For instance, I believe that a full size car versus a compact size car is not consitent with maintaining "competitive advantages", everything else being equal, in the stock classes. I think there should be "Full Size Stock Classes', and an "Intermediate/Compact Size Stock Classes, as well as the defining difference being the wheelbase, along with the weight divided by the HP rating.

Here is a chart I made up years ago regarding wheelbase for Stock Classes, between the early 1960's:

Vehicle - Year - Wheelbase
Chevy II (or Nova) - 1962-1967 - 110"
Chevelle - 1964-1966 - 115"
Chevy (full size) - 1961-1963 - 119"
Pontiac (full size) - 1961 - 119"
Pontiac (full size) - 1962-1963 - 120"
Pontiac Tempest - 1962-1963 - 112"
Mercury Comet - 1964 - 114"
Ford Fairlane - 1964 - 115.5"
Ford Falcon - 1964 - 109.5"
Ford (full size) - 1961-1963 - 119"
Ford Mustang - 1964-1968 - 108"
Dodge (full size) - 1962 - 116"
Dodge (full size) - 1963-1964 - 119"
Plymouth (full size) - 1963-1964 - 116"
Dodge Lancer - 1962 - 106.5"
Dodge Dart - 1963-1964 - 111"

Based on the (full size cars), 116" wheelbase appears to be the minimum wheelbase in the FULL SIZE STOCK CLASSES.
Based on the INTERMEDIATE AND COMPACT SIZE STOCK CLASSES, the wheelbase should include cars with wheelbases between 115" and down to 106".

Any car on the above list could accomodate the brands 7-liter engines under the hood...

 

[George Klass]

Living in SoCal, I attended every NHRA Winternational event from 1961 through 1965, as they were all held at Pomona. I remember very well the 1963 event. I also attened the NHRA meeting with all the S/S racers, the meeting that caused all the comotion, with racers yelling at NHRA and vice versa. Having a 409/409 myself (1962), I hung out with a lot of the Chevy racers, Nicholson, Leal, Terry Prince, etc. All these guys had the new Z-11 Impalas. And all these cars went through the usual tech procedure, and all of them had been NHRA approved and classified as being S/S legal. That started the big broughhaha. There were 40 or 50 409/409 Super Stockers there, none of which were were Z-11 "light weights", but they were also approved and classified by NHRA as S/S legal. Naturally, the non Z-11 racers did NOT want to be paired up with a light weight Impala, with 427 cubic inches. A few of the non Z-11 Chevys were classified as S/S, and some as A/S. Although NHRA Tech Dept had been givien the spec sheet on the Z-11 in advance, I'm not sure they ever read it. I do know for sure that they had no idea that only about 50 cars were going to be built by Chevrolet, and even less when it came to the Pontiac Swiss Cheese 421's. It caused a ton of stress among the racers, NHRA, and a Chevy rep that was in attendance. When all this came to light at the meeting, NHRA called a halt and the meeting was put on pause for a short while, as NHRA tried to figure out what to do. Fortunately, there was the FX class for some to race in, and NHRA created on the fly, the LP class for the rest of the Z-11's, a seperate class for all the lightweight limited production cars to race in and still be in the Stock Class.

 

[Iowa 409 Guy]

Cool history lesson...