FRANK SANDERS Z-11 FOR SALE

[Blk61409]

View attachment 57881View attachment 57882View attachment 57883View attachment 57884
I got this trophy from Ben Tirabassi from Niagara Falls years ago. Ben had the black/black Z-11 that sold last year at Kissimmee last year. He told me this was Frank Sanders trophy. Have no idea where Ben got this. Ben was around a lot of Z-11 stuff.
Interesting writing on the bottom.....Nov. 15, 1962. 12.17....123.87. I Googled San Gabriel Valley and could not find this race.
Just my little piece of Z-11 history!!!!

Phil, this must have been the ‘62 which would have really been quick and fast.

I have both of Franks contracts for racing for Rudolph Chev and the first one is dated Jan 16, 1963 for the Z-11 car which he had to return Sept, 1963.

The ‘62 he signed the contract Feb 27,1962. It had a credit for $300 for the 327 engine it came with but it had positraction and metallic brakes, no 409.
He had to return the car Sept 20, 1962 unless other arrangements were made. A friend of mine bought it with the aluminum front end and 2 piece Z type intake, preproduction stuff, I actually bought the Z stuff that went on my 61 409 flattop.

Just a few more pieces of the puzzle

 

[real61ss]

Saw the car at the Muscle Car Nationals in Chicago. Such a great car, great color. I agree its worth more than $300 but in this market, would be lucky to hit $260-270. Seems the classic car market has really slowed this year. Mecum Chicago was DEAD. No good cars, no buyers. Tons of no sales. Sad to see the downward trend happening again.

Well, I don't think you can put much stock in what happened at that auction if there were no good cars, then there won't be any buyers. I attended the Southby's auction in Hershey last fall, there was a 61 SS there (real deal), I bid it to 100k and didn't get it so it ain't all bad

 

[pvs409]

The first 409 convention Phil had in Kansas City he had the Frank Sanders Z-11 car.
In the book with the car there was a hand written note that I found from the operator of Sioux City Dragway Bob Coney (at the Sioux City Airport) to Frank Sanders. This old dragstrip(closed in late 1960s or early 1970's) was on a old airport taxiway is 2 miles from my house and I used to race there in the 1960's.

The operator Bob Coney paid Frank Sanders to match race at the drag strip as the note said. I think the $ amount in the note was $ 500. I have a picture of the note somewhere I think and the car.

Paul

 

[LMBRJQ 60]

Well, I don't think you can put much stock in what happened at that auction if there were no good cars, then there won't be any buyers. I attended the Southby's auction in Hershey last fall, there was a 61 SS there (real deal), I bid it to 100k and didn't get it so it ain't all bad

Paul.
Was the as a 409 or 348 ?

Steve

 

[models916]

Wow. To go home from a race track with money in my pocket.

 

[real61ss]

Paul.
Was the as a 409 or 348 ?

Steve

It was a 409 car.

 

[Greg Reimer]

View attachment 57881View attachment 57882View attachment 57883View attachment 57884
I got this trophy from Ben Tirabassi from Niagara Falls years ago. Ben had the black/black Z-11 that sold last year at Kissimmee last year. He told me this was Frank Sanders trophy. Have no idea where Ben got this. Ben was around a lot of Z-11 stuff.
Interesting writing on the bottom.....Nov. 15, 1962. 12.17....123.87. I Googled San Gabriel Valley and could not find this race.
Just my little piece of Z-11 history!!!!

San Gabriel Valley Drag Strip (or San Gabriel) was in Irwindale just below Live Oak Avenue next to the levee for the San Gabriel River outlet of Santa Fe Dam. The 605 freeway built in the late '60's obliterated it,also the So Cal Edison sub station took over the rest of it. The current Irwindale Speedway and the 1/8th mile drag strip came along around 1999-2000,and is on the west side of the 605 freeway at the same location just west of the original. You can stand in the staging lanes just on the east side of the property and look across the 605 Freeway and see the original site of the drag strip. It predated the original Irwindale Raceway, opened about 1965 and shut down in 1977 . San Gabriel ran from about 1955 to 1963. Too many ghost tracks around any more. Dyno Don Nicholson ran there,too in the late 50's,early '60's. Lots of history around here.

 

[LMBRJQ 60]

It was a 409 car.

Hi Tommy.
Thanks for the reply
I was thinking that from some posts on here a few years ago that there wasn't a proven documented 409 1961ss with its original engine to be found anymore.
Did you get any photos of it or do you know where it ended up?
Steve

 

[Phil Reed]

So Mr. Pat.......what car would Frank be racing in Nov.???????

 

[real61ss]

Hi Tommy.
Thanks for the reply
I was thinking that from some posts on here a few years ago that there wasn't a proven documented 409 1961ss with its original engine to be found anymore.
Did you get any photos of it or do you know where it ended up?
Steve

Steve,
I don't really think there is a real 61ss 409 with it's original motor in the world. I know of a couple of 61 Chevrolets with 61 409 motors but they aren't Super Sports. I doubt there are many 61SS's with a 623 block, Robert Street has one and the car that I referenced at the sale in Hershey should have one but I could not read the numbers on the back of the block. The car at Hershey was Dale Armstrong's car. I don't know if you are award of the Armstrong car but it is thought to be the first SS409 built, it was a mule car that was used to test the new motor, the car was equipped with the required SS equipment and A/C and it had a second cowl tag attached to the top of the cowl. I've known about this car since back in the late 80's but had never actually seen it. Dale passed away several years ago and I had all but forgotten about the car until last fall when I saw a list of cars that were scheduled to cross the auction block at Hershey. When I saw the picture I immediately thought of Dale Armstrong and wondered if it could be his car. As soon as I arrived at Hershey I went straight to the storage area where the auction cars were and as soon as I saw the second cowl tag I knew it was the car. Verne Frantz had documented the car for Dale years ago and he and I had discussed the car so I called Verne and got him to verify the vin. The strange thing was the car was not advertized as anything but a 61SS 409. This is a one of one car!! So, I'm wondering if anyone else at this auction knows what this car is, I really didn't want the car because of my current interest in Pontiac's but I wasn't going to stand by and let someone steal it. So, I called my banker and got a letter from them so I could get a bidders pass. That night when it crossed the block my wife, Robert Street and myself were in the building and they started the bidding at 50k, it when 5k at a time with a bunch of people bidding, when it got to 75k, everyone dropped out except me and one other guy. Apparently me and him were the only ones that knew what the car was, he would bid 5k and I would bid 5k until it got to 100k. I put the 100k bid on it and he came right back with 105k. The auctioneer tried to keep me bidding but I would not go anymore although I think it was a 150k car. My problem was I couldn't see who I was bidding against and Robert was no help, he was just drinking beer! I was concerned that I was bidding against the house but I don't think now that I was because if I had been I think I would have recieved a phone call the next day to see if I was still interested and I never heard a word, don't have any idea who bought the car or where it went. At least I made sure no one stole it. I have some photos on my phone which I will post

 

[real61ss]

61SS409 at the auction in Hershey.

 

[real61ss]

 

[real61ss]

 

[real61ss]

They were right on the money with their estimate of what the car would bring but I don't think they realized what the car was. I should have kept after it and I would now be the owner of the rarest 61 SS in existance but as the Gambler says "there is a time to hold'm and a time to fold'm" and I folded.

 

[Tom Kochtanek]

Wow, it even had A/C, that's kind of unusual!

I wonder who the lucky guy was?

 

[real61ss]

Tom,
The car was a test car, they put the A/C on it to see if the new 409 would cool itself

 

[Blk61409]

So Mr. Pat.......what car would Frank be racing in Nov.???????

I think he was racing the 62.

His contract ended Sept 20 1962 after the nationals. He too had received the aluminum front end, pre-Z-11 heads, etc all in late summer just like Hayden told me he did and all the other big name racers. However, I know for a fact he was racing it later in Phoenix, because that’s where my friend saw it after winning several big races and brought it back to Texas. So, I bet Frank raced it in November in LA and the next weekend in Phoenix where my friend bought it.
I called my friend a couple of years ago trying to get Photos, etc and he said he went through a bad divorce many years back and everything was thrown away (:

Anyway, that’s the best I can piece it together. At one time the car still lived here in No Texas, but no one seems to know where.

 

[Blk61409]

I think he was racing the 62.

His contract ended Sept 20 1962 after the nationals. He too had received the aluminum front end, pre-Z-11 heads, etc all in late summer just like Hayden told me he did and all the other big name racers. However, I know for a fact he was racing it later in Phoenix, because that’s where my friend saw it after winning several big races and brought it back to Texas. So, I bet Frank raced it in November in LA and the next weekend in Phoenix where my friend bought it.
I called my friend a couple of years ago trying to get Photos, etc and he said he went through a bad divorce many years back and everything was thrown away (:

Anyway, that’s the best I can piece it together. At one time the car still lived here in No Texas, but no one seems to know where.

Oh, Frank was allowed to race after the contract as long as Rudolph Chevy did not want the car back and Frank was making his payments for the short term loan. As it turned out Frank did very well selling the car for a high price with lots of free race parts on it

 

[LMBRJQ 60]

What happened at the auction?
Did it sell?

Steve

 

[real61ss]

What happened at the auction?
Did it sell?

Steve

Steve,
We got two conversations going here and its my fault but if you are asking about the 61SS, yes it sold for 105k plus commission