Gushing Oil Leak!

[Roger D]

Not the first post I wanted to have - but . . .

Just registered a '63 Biscayne w/ a 348 replacment block 340 hi po heads and 2 carters port matched to the engine and a 4 speed in front of 3.55's open rear. (Plans for a stroked 409, TREMEC TKO 600 WILWOODs etc. etc.).

Ran it for a breakin cruise w/ my son for about 15 miles - ran like a champ - stopped to gas up and check the oil - down 1 qt. of oil (has a 409 pan). Add 1 qt. - drive home - smoking and leaking oil FAST all the way. No oil registers on the dipstick - add more oil, start engine - pumps right out somewhere around the filter assembly.

Removed the filter assembly - no ring gasket anywhere in sight - replaced filter w/ the proper FRAM cartridge, add gasket, change oil. Add new oil - start the engine - NO OIL PRESSURE - engine stalls out quickly and oil is RUNNING out AGAIN.

What gives????

Any help would greatly be apprciated.

Roger D

 

[MRHP]

oil leak

If the oil is not coming from the filter assy, there is an oil port just above the filter assy. Your leak may also be coming from there. I hope no engine damage was done from running engine out of oil.

 

[Roger D]

MRHP:

Thanks - I think the engine is OK - I hope. . .

Oil can be seen running down the side of the filter as well as the frame right behind the filter immediately after starting the engine - all due to adding asingle qt of oil?.

What would cause the oil to leak out of the oil port?

Engine was totally rebuilt about 5,000 miles ago, new everthing - original crank, block has a .060 overbore.

 

[tripowerguy]

The port above oil filter is for the sending unit for the oil pressure. The sending unit has been known to rupture in the past. This is the unit your idoit light hooks up to. I hope no ill has befallen the engine. Roy

 

[droptop62]

When the engine is losing it's oil and there isn't any oil pressure, It doesn't take long to do some damage. That is an expensive engine to take chances with.
I would have shut it down and had it trailered or towed home.
Check it out thoroughly before driving it or running it again.

 

[Roger D]

Thanks for the replies - I'll have the car put on a flatbed tom and hauled over to the garage - get the problem sorted out and then have the internals checked - I hope the bearings etc. are ok - if not it will be $$$ for a rebuild - ouch!

 

[dq409]

Also dump the Fram filter ! go with most any other brand,, dq



I`ll hear about this,,,

 

[Dond409]

No Fram

Anybody that is somebody on this forum knows that using a fram filter is a no no. no1:

 

[60biscayne]

Fram Filters

Can someone explain why Fram filters are considered so bad?? A few years back, they were rated way up there. I've been using them on my everyday drivers with no problems. I realize these companies get bought out, and quality changes, by cheapening them up. Opinions????? Thanks!

 

[tripowerguy]

Fram as well as AC and others have went way cheap on their oil filters. All paper no metal to reinforce and stablize the filter. The filters such as Wix, Baldwin and Napa are more exspensive but are superior in every way. One thing that was not mentioned is there an adapter for a spin on filter on the car or is it still the canister style. Some of the adapters for spin on don't seal up. I have one under my work bench that wouldn't seal on two engines. Probably not made for early Chev engines. Roy

 

[bobs409]

Fram air filters are cheap too! :evil

Put one side by side with just about any other brand and you'll see the Fram is much thinner. (like 1/2" of an inch at least)

 

[SteveD409]

What Tripowerguy says, had this oil pump out syndrome once when I tried to install a spin on filter converter.

SteveD

 

[CDNpontiac409guy]

Hey Roger

When you removed the oil filter canister, did you then get up into the block and remove the two 7/16" head bolts, and the the aluminum pressure relief assembly out.... so you can REALLY make sure that the old O ring was out ?
Only takes a minute... and leaves no question.

I personally will run ONLY the factory canister filters on my cars ( including my 409 race engine ). The AC PF 141 oil filters that I buy, are made by Wix... The Wix name is literally crossed off with a felt marker .

When re-installing, first put the relief valve back in place. Then evenly poke the new O ring up into the groove all the way around... making sure it stays there.

With the canister completely clean and dry, pour 1 litre ( quart ) of oil into it... then set the filter over top, and let it sink into the canister. You can then add a bit more oil, bringing the level up to about 1/4" below the top.

Hold the canister level ( obviously ), and put it up into place, and rotate it to engage the threads... continuing to rotate it by hand, until you make contact lightly. Gently wobble the canister around ( this is important ) to make sure that it is fitting up into the "pocket" in the block. You will likely find that it was not. Then you can continue to spin the assembly and/or 3/4" bolt head by hand until it is snug.
Only then, can you tke your 3/8" drive 3/4" socket on an extension, with a small ratchet, and tighten it up. When tightening, bear in mind what you are tightening the canister against... a rubber O ring... so intense torque is not good:eek: .

Yes, this is a little messy. Oil WILL run down your hand while you're installing the filter !

However, to install an oil filter without first filling it with oil as much as practical,
is UNTHINKABLE:eek:

 

[dq409]

Are you using the oridinal heavy steel canister or do you have the aftermarket spin on filter adaptor setup?
The later can sometimes be a bear to install and if it isn`t installed right will puke oil faster then a cow pi**ing on a flat rock !!

Aubrey gave very detailed direction on installin the factory canister. I would follow them to the tee and you should be OK,,dq

 

[jester]

I had a problem with the oil pouring out of the canister. I found that one of the bolts that hold the Lakewood bell housing on went through into the side of the canister. I installed a shorter bolt to stop the leak.

 

[CDNpontiac409guy]

I found that one of the bolts tha holds the Lakewood bell housing on went through into the side of the canister. I installed a shorter bolt to stop the leak.

Good point, Jester ... Because I'm so stubborn that I insist on running a canister filter on a race car, yes, I too had to grind about half the thickness off of two of the grade 8 bolt heads in order to make clearance for the canister. I knew about this before, so it was no issue... but if a guy was installing that filter after the scattershield was in place, a person could not notice that the canister is being pushed sideways.... especially when laying on your back under the car, with your nose against the control arm, oil pouring down your hand and up your arm:eek:

 

[Roger D]

Thanks for all the replies and good advice.

The car was trailered to the wrench's today - I'll have the scoop tom. and will post the verdict - certainly hope I'm not into a rebuild - especially if its just to keep the car up and running while waiting for the stroker to go in this Spring.

Roger D.

 

[Roger D]

Got the car back today - a mix of metal and plastic pressure oil sending unit/lines cobbled together (a real mess of a job) - which let loose was the culprit. Engine damage- if any - appears for now, neglible -

Thanks to all of you for your help - evryone had it figured dead on.

Now I'm just waiting for the stroker & etc. for the late Spring - I'll keep everyone posted on how that project (and others) progress. Once I figure out how, I'll post pictures.

Roger D