Need Your Help!!

[Wes McCallum]

How can I tell if this 1964 Impala SS 409, is a true 409 car and was produced as one???

The VIN is 41447F168715, is there a list of production numbers that would show?

How to I prove its a real 409 car?

Thanks in advance

 

[pvs409]

Nothing in the serial number or cowl tag tell you if the car was a 409 car (only that it was a V-8 from the factory -the 1447 in the serial # is for a V-8 car from the factory)

The rest of the information on if the car was a 409 car are: does it have a return line all the way to the gas tank ? Does it have a ballast resistor in the starter wiring harness. Does it have all deep dual groove upper and dual lower deep groove pulleys ? Does it have a 409 only fan shroud for a 64 409 car? does it have a 409 original radiator ?
Is it a 4 speed car ? Does it have a factory hooded dash tach and what is the red line of the tach ?
Is it a single 4 barrel car or dual four barrel -if so what kind of carb(s) and carb numbers and intake does it have ?
Does it have 409 full 2 1/2" big tube exhaust manifolds (400 and 425 HP cars). Some of these items just help with if the 409 motor has all the right 409 items.

Does the 409 motor have a serial number stamp starting with F from the serial number, on the front passenger pad below the head along with the stamping for the motor build information starting with T ?

Paul

 

[Don Jacks]

Wes,the vin.number will tell you nothing other than wheather it came down with either a 6cyl.or a v8.The only real way is to have either the original sales papers or the build sheet[good luck].There are differences in the way the car was built,such as fuel line routing,but this stuff is reproduced and easily changed.For the wallets sake,uunless I personally knew the seller,I would assume that it's a clone until the seller proves without a doubt that he's telling the truth about the car.

 

[Wes McCallum]

There in is the problem.............I can't prove it either It has all the items

 

[Wes McCallum]

Thanks for the feed back It would have been nice to have better info on the older cars

 

[DonSSDD]

Is it priced as an original 409 car? What condition? If its a good car for the money, buy it?

Post a pic of the original stamping on the front of the block, was it restamped? Check all date codes and casting numbers for the block etc. and see if they match the build date. Post pics of the car and engine compartment.

 

[models916]

Partial VIN stamped on the right engine pad would show that is is at least a well researched clone or that it is the correct engine to chassis. Look for it. If it's a 4 speed car, some of the clutch linkage for the 409 was unique.

 

[Wes McCallum]

The engine has been replaced with a 1963, those numbers are correct. Its not a numbers matching I know, bell housing, linkage are correct. It was a 1/4 mile car for years, I know that. I need t0
find a build sheet to prove its pedigreed. Any idea if and where they put build sheets on a 64 car?

 

[jdk971]

if it has one, it would be in or behind the back seat. jmho jim

 

[chevy man]

Build sheet could be on top of the gas tank!
I don't know about every state, but here in Missouri the horse power was stated on the title. If the title showed like 54 hp, that would indicate it to be a big block. If it showed 48 hp on the title it meant a small block. Just a suggestion !

 

[Tom Kochtanek]

I've never found a build sheet in tearing down a couple of "original" cars, but I have found inspection sheets and such under the rear seat.

In terms of value, to many it won't matter if your vehicle was a factory 409 car when built, since it now has a replacement engine. It would be interesting, but likely will not affect value as would be the case in a factory original setup with matching numbers, etc. That is my opinion only .

Have fun with your former "quarter mile" car!

TomK

 

[Wes McCallum]

Huh....that's what I believed, perhaps it was just a way to back out of the deal ! I will search the car and see if there is any hidden paperwork.

Thank you much fellows....your the best.

 

[Carmine]

Chevy really missed the boat on this issue. Not sure how far back you can go, I'm thinking the early 60's, but if you send PHS (Pontiac Historical Society) $65.00 and your VIN, they'll send you a copy of your build sheet. It list exactly what your car left the factory with. So nice to have. As explained to me, Pontiac was going to discard all their build records and some individual bought them all and turned the purchase into a business. I'm glad he did. A lot of cloning going on all over. With these build sheets, it would be hard to deceive anyone, Carmine.

 

[Richard Martin]

"Pontiac Historical Society"

Carmine:

The name of the Company is--Pontiac Historical Services--and the man who purchased the records from the Pontiac Division of GM is Pontiac historian Jim Mattison.

www.classicalpontiac.com/articles/99poci/phs.html

A while back I read an article that Mr Mattison is retiring and someone else is taking over the company. I not sure that is true or not.

 

[Carmine]

Thanks for the correction Richard and that link, Carmine.

 

[DonSSDD]

For Canadian built or any new car sold in Canada, you can get some information like original motor, tranny, colours for Chevies; for 64 up, you can get a build sheet.