Parts needed for 1961 Belair Project

[409EL]

Hey, need a few parts for a 1961 Belair, looking for a floor shift steering column, good non cracked steering wheel, headers that fit lol, or temporary huggers, upper 409 power steering bracket, 3724816 water pump pulley, 3766987 crank pulley. Thanks

 

[boxerdog]

I have a pretty good stock 61 Belair steering wheel, don't think it's cracked but I will check it out tomorrow.

 

[pvs409]

I have a 61 Belair steering wheel has some minor cracks( almost impossible to find a used steering wheel without some cracks- cracks are easy to fix ( I have two mint 61 horn rings and I have 2 mint 61 Belair round horn caps - A 1961 Belair cap is not the same as a 62 Belair horn ring round cap.

A friend of mine in western Nebraska - has a factory 61 & 62 4 speed column - $750 he’s on marketplace on Facebook.
His column has factory tach mounting holes in the colum.

Both 409 upper and lower pulleys are deep groove dual groove pulleys . The upper water pump 409 pulley is actually 2 pulleys with a spacer between them.
I have the 409 dual lower pulley and the two piece 409 upper pulley.

Paul

 

[pvs409]

There are 3 power steering pump brackets - you need the one that bolts to exhaust manifold and attaches to the back side of the original factory power steering pump? with a pipe on the back of the original pump
The power steering bracket for the back side of the PS pump and uses a Allen head stud with hex nuts on the exhaust manifold.
The 409 power steering pump uses a 3 spoke deep groove pulley.
Paul

 

[409EL]

Thanks for the responses, I have a couple of good horn rings. and cast pulley, my lower pump bracket looks like the one in the Snow Cars kit 6640. taken off my parts car, could it be a BB car? I'm wondering what the difference would be between the SB to BB lower brackets? Upper bracket 3786873 is the one I need, or both if I can't find the differences. I just need the front w/p pulley 3724816 and crank pulley 3766987.

I will get my son to check on marketplace, I have 2 columns, one 3sp-one auto, does anyone know which one would be rarer if I decide to modify?

Please let me know about the wheels, price and condition, and pulleys, thanks Dave and Paul, Earl

 

[Murphdog]

Pulleys:
As per 427John the 3770245 will sub for the 2 piece water pump pair. From what I can make from the parts book 62 & 63 used the 2 piece water pump pair. 64 1st design used the 3770245. 62, 63 & 64 used the 3766987 original pulley on the crank. The 3858533 pulley is a direct replacement but it is constructed differently. All of these are available as repops through various vendors or on ebay. 3770245 & 3858533 may be available from GM still. The ebay stuff, some are OE correct, some are repop, which may function properly but may appear differently in construction characteristics. Like Rickeys61 said, I would think the 2 belts with the idler should fix your problem. SEE: 348 and 409 engines/W water pumps, Monday 1/1/23 STAY COOL!
PS brackets: See my post from August 23 (search for power steering pump / Murphdog)
The main bucket/bracket that bolts to the front of the block that the pump mounts in looks kinda similar but the bolt hole spacing is different. The 2 holes are spaced, 1.625" for SBC, 2.0" for W & 2.25" for BBC SBC & W are very similar. BBC pushes the pump further left.
Jeff

 

[pvs409]

Good comments Jeff, The 2nd design deep groove lower pulley I was going to mention.
I was also going to mention the bolt mounting holes for a 409 Power steering cradle bracket are different - nice to post the spacing. I was going to test mount the bracket on your 409 block.
Paul

 

[boxerdog]

Well here's what I have, it's beige, worn in places, horn ring is good, some very fine cracks. I have no idea on value or shipping costs.

 

[Murphdog]

Good comments Jeff, The 2nd design deep groove lower pulley I was going to mention.
I was also going to mention the bolt mounting holes for a 409 Power steering cradle bracket are different - nice to post the spacing. I was going to test mount the bracket on your 409 block.
Paul

Don't get 2nd design lower crank pulley confused with 2nd design water pump pulley. The 2nd design (3858533) lower pulley is a direct replacement for the earlier (3766987) pulley, they differ in construction design only. Same length/depth & diameters. 2nd design water pump pulley is a different deal. It only works with 2nd design water pumps, but still uses the same crank pulleys.
Jeff

 

[409EL]

Thanks Jeff, that was exactly what I was looking for in regards to the lower bracket measurements. Checked with GM online, numbers discontinued, maybe a phone call might find one on the self somewhere. I wasn't aware of different water pumps, I'm using Edelbrocks version, hope there is no issues lol.

PMs sent to boxerdog/pvs409.

 

[boxerdog]

Here are the back view pics

 

[Murphdog]

Thanks Jeff, that was exactly what I was looking for in regards to the lower bracket measurements. Checked with GM online, numbers discontinued, maybe a phone call might find one on the self somewhere. I wasn't aware of different water pumps, I'm using Edelbrocks version, hope there is no issues lol.

PMs sent to boxerdog/pvs409.

I am pretty sure the Edelbrock, Speedway or eBay pumps are all 1st design. 1 obvious difference between the SBC & W main pump bucket/bracket is the mounting holes that mount to the block. SBC uses a 3/8 bolt. W uses a 7/16 bolt.
Jeff

 

[409EL]

Thanks everyone, looks like I've got everything coming.