W water pumps

Murphdog

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
Can anyone elaborate on 1st & 2nd design water pumps. I am under the impression that late 64 & 65 used a 2nd design pump. I have it in my head that the pump pulley bolt flange was located differently?? The Rock does not list any W pumps.
Jeff
 
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oldskydog

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 10
a post from Jims409 awhile back.

Sep 8, 2003

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#3

When this question came up once before a guy from Show Cars was kind enough to email me and explain the differences in the car pumps. Here's what he said... THE 1958 TO 1964 W/P IS THE SHORT PUMP WITH A 1.165 OD BEARING OD OF THE CASTING IS 1.625 IT IS 5.500 FROM THE BLOCK FLANGE TO THE FAN HUB
THE 1964 LATE AND 1965 W/P IS THE LONG PUMP OR BIG BEARING PUMP HAS A 1.500 OD BEARING OD OF THE CASTING IS 2.100 THIS PUMP IS 5.875 FROM THE BLOCK FLANGE TO THE FAN HUB THIS IS 3/8 OR .375 LONGER THEN THE SHORT PUMP IT ALSO NEEDS A 3/8 DEEPER SET OF PULLEYS ONLY USED IN LATE 1964 AND 1965
OUR REBUILD KITS HAVE THE STEEL TYPE IMPELLER
GOOD LUCK
SHOW CARS AUTOMOTIVE INC.
58375 COUNTY ROAD 21
NEW ULM, MN. 56073
507-233-1958 FAX 800-64-SS-FAX
WWW.DR409.COM
SHOWCARS@NEWULMTEL.NET
 

Murphdog

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
Thanks Cecil. That is making sense. SC does list a late 64/65 pump. I have a 2 deep groove water pump pulley that I marked as coming off of a 65/340hp/JE engine and when putting it beside a 3770245 2 deep groove 1 piece pulley it appears to be about a 1/2 a groove off, deeper offset. I have had this pulley 30-35 years. It's construction is a hub with 2 individual v groove sheaves pressed and spot welded into place.
Jeff
 

Murphdog

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 2
Water Pump Pulley Poop! 95% certain on this, but I am human! I would gladly hear comments.
Jeff
All pulleys pictured are of the deep groove design. There are/may be other applications besides what is mentioned.
Will be mentioning them from left to right.
1st & 2nd pics are of the standard rear pulley design used in the normal 2 pulley set on 409's.
Left is a 3713974 ?? This is the standard rear pulley used 61-63 - 409, some HP 348 & 10-30 truck. I have never seen this number stamped into a pulley.
Right is a 3827846, visually the same except it appears to have the 3720616 reinforcement spot welded into the back of the nose and it is thicker in that area. This pulley was listed as a Corvette & 10-30 truck application, and it has the number stamped in. There was a NOS one listed on ebay 1/2/24. The numbers were jumbled. My pulley the numbers are in order but VERY faint.

3rd pic. On left is a 3770245, 1 pc 2 groove that can be used in place of the 2 piece set mentioned above. Listed as 64 409 1st design, some SBC HP & 10-30 truck. On the right is the normal 2 piece set, 3713974 rear & 3724816 front

4th pic is 64 1st design 3770245 left, 64-65 2nd design 409 center, 61-63 3713974 / 3724816 2pc set on right.

5th & 6th pics are of the pulley I have marked as coming off of a 65 JE 340hp engine. This has to be the 2nd design as the offset is different by essentially the amount Cecil shows in the chart above. This pulley did not have a number stamped in it. It's construction consists of a center cone with 2 separate V sheaves pressed & spot welded on.
The parts book lists:
64-65 pass 409 exc air cond 2nd design - 3850141
64-65 pass 409 w/air cond, exc PS, H/Per dual 4BC 2nd design - 3850977
64-65 pass 409 air cond w/ps exc h/per dual 4BC 2nd design - 3850978
Not sure which of the above 3 is the pulley I have.
From what I know a W with AC uses the 2nd groove from the back and PS then moves to a 3rd groove forward on the crank.
 

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oldskydog

Well Known Member
Supporting Member 10
That looks like the 57-61? SHP pully on the solid lifter 270, 283, 290 engines in Corvette and full size cars. I have several of them.
 
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