Bayer Z-11
- Thread starter 409Kid
- Start date
Greg Reimer
Well Known Member
I remember a place called Cyclone Excells Weld back in the day that was noted for being a good place to take broken engine parts. They did cast iron repairs of all sorts of things.
409Kid
Well Known Member
Great pics. Raj. I would like to set up a time to talk to you directly. Can you let me know when that is most convenient for you ? Possibly this weekend? I haven’t been able to dig up any other information as of yet. Don’t know if there were multiple owners prior to Von or whether it was only “Barstow rich kid”. The real mystery for me at this point is how and why did the car end up locally in Yuba City where Von acquired it?
Ranger pics appear to be at the winter nationals in Pomona. Wonder what year those may have been taken ?
I’m also trying to trace back the history of the Z-11 engine that came out of the ‘’30s Plymouth coupe that had been in in the Sacramento region from the mid ‘60s and into the early 2000’s the Phil Rees purchased and Dennis(?) bought. I’ve had no PM’s from either to my inquiries.
The second Z-11 that was rumored to be in the Sacramento region in the ‘70’s was said to be white according to my source. It may have been repainted that color. The source didn’t see it firsthand but he is a reliable source and was very much into the W- series seen at that time.
Again, Thanks for these pics and I hope we can talk directly at your convenience soon.
Ranger pics appear to be at the winter nationals in Pomona. Wonder what year those may have been taken ?
I’m also trying to trace back the history of the Z-11 engine that came out of the ‘’30s Plymouth coupe that had been in in the Sacramento region from the mid ‘60s and into the early 2000’s the Phil Rees purchased and Dennis(?) bought. I’ve had no PM’s from either to my inquiries.
The second Z-11 that was rumored to be in the Sacramento region in the ‘70’s was said to be white according to my source. It may have been repainted that color. The source didn’t see it firsthand but he is a reliable source and was very much into the W- series seen at that time.
Again, Thanks for these pics and I hope we can talk directly at your convenience soon.
409Kid
Well Known Member
You can see in the “BRKid” Ranger II photos the Z-11 oil pan is hanging under the car, tow bar brackets barely visible and the car’s relettering still shows “Engine by Jack Bayer”. Also, the front filler panel is missing and the “Mopar” style hood scoop now on the hood.
What was Ranger (1)? That in itself may lead to a name also. If these pics were taken from eliminations at the Winternationals, then there surely would be NHRA records of who this car belonged to somewhere. But where to look? It sure would be interesting if this person survives today and to talk with him.
What was Ranger (1)? That in itself may lead to a name also. If these pics were taken from eliminations at the Winternationals, then there surely would be NHRA records of who this car belonged to somewhere. But where to look? It sure would be interesting if this person survives today and to talk with him.
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My engine was not from the coupe
I’d love to see the papers(write up) on that magazine test………
……..I believe in an article written about the assassin, in which was a gentleman who worked for motion at one point, he had installed an aluminum front end on that car…….I know it was originally a 409 car and he changed it to a 327 I’ll have to reread the article to make sure double check my words……Was the 63 impala campaigned as the Aluminator, originally a Z 11 car by a different name……??? Just found on the other site that I frequent a posting by Verne…….In which he states the Aluminator is the Billy Lagana Z 11, later painted red white and blue and name the American way………
……..I believe in an article written about the assassin, in which was a gentleman who worked for motion at one point, he had installed an aluminum front end on that car…….I know it was originally a 409 car and he changed it to a 327 I’ll have to reread the article to make sure double check my words……Was the 63 impala campaigned as the Aluminator, originally a Z 11 car by a different name……??? Just found on the other site that I frequent a posting by Verne…….In which he states the Aluminator is the Billy Lagana Z 11, later painted red white and blue and name the American way………
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Greg Reimer
Well Known Member
I looked at the white Z-11 while it was in the back yard here in SoCal. It was for sale in a local d paper for 2500.00.It did still have the aluminum fenders, the hood went with it but it had a round hole around six or eight inches in diameter, had a straight axle front end and the rear end had been mounted forward about 8 inches or so. It would have been well worth the money even then because of what it was, after all, what would a presentable set of aluminum fenders be worth today? A good aluminum man could have fixed the hood.The doors were gutted as well. If you had a '63 impala 2 door HT that was complete enough, it might have been a fairly easy reconstruction project, but finding the little pieces would have kept you busy until now at least. How do you reproduce original parts when you don't have any samples to copy in the first place?
Greg Reimer
Well Known Member
Questions to all you Z experts
out there---
1.Did Z-11 cars have an aluminum radiator core support?
2.Did Z-11 cars have aluminum hood hinges?
3.Did the Z-11 have an aluminum piece that went between the lower part of the front fenders that the hood latch bolted to?
4.Was the hood latch aluminum or steel? How about the battery tray?
5.How about the fan shroud?
Just asking. I have nothing Z-11 except memories of seeing a few parts and a lot of pictures of these cars.
out there---
1.Did Z-11 cars have an aluminum radiator core support?
2.Did Z-11 cars have aluminum hood hinges?
3.Did the Z-11 have an aluminum piece that went between the lower part of the front fenders that the hood latch bolted to?
4.Was the hood latch aluminum or steel? How about the battery tray?
5.How about the fan shroud?
Just asking. I have nothing Z-11 except memories of seeing a few parts and a lot of pictures of these cars.
409envy
Well Known Member
1: Core support was steel
2: Hood hinges were steel with special lower tension springs
3: Not sure what piece you are talking about but the grill supports and the bumper filler panel were aluminum, the hood latch mechanism was steel
4: hood latch and battery tray were steel
5: Fan shroud was aluminum.
Greg Reimer
Well Known Member
Your answers were exactly what I wanted to know. It seems that if you were doing a Z-11 car, the fenders and hood would be just the start as far as rounding up aluminum parts. The part I was asking about was the grille supports and the bumper filler panel. That fan shroud would have to be a real hard part to find.
Show cars automotive repops the fan shroud and I have one on my car but not sure how correct they are compared to real ones and they repop the air cleaner also which is my next thing on my want list but hard to justify
409Kid
Well Known Member
The Z-11 parts list (if I read it correctly ) seems to refer to the shroud as lt and rt sides with separate PNs. Were these really in 2 halves? And if so, were they then gas welded, spot welded or riveted together ? Did they have the same stamping as a steel 409 shroud? Any one have a full set of pictures of an original aluminum shroud. What gauge is the material?
Regarding the hoods; Was the inner structure also aluminum? Did both come from the same stamping as the steel hoods? Maybe that’s not the right question. Did they appear the same as the steel hoods? What was used for the nut plate to attach it to the hinges ? Again a set of detailed pics would be helpful if anyone can share them. These are both items I’ll have to have made unless I can find originals that are affordable. I have a tin and aluminum fabricator that does meticulous work. If it’s simply a matter of getting him a ‘63 hood, grill braces and ‘63 ‘09 shroud to use as patterns then that will be certainly do-able.
PM me and I’ll forward an email to send pics to. Thanks in advance
Regarding the hoods; Was the inner structure also aluminum? Did both come from the same stamping as the steel hoods? Maybe that’s not the right question. Did they appear the same as the steel hoods? What was used for the nut plate to attach it to the hinges ? Again a set of detailed pics would be helpful if anyone can share them. These are both items I’ll have to have made unless I can find originals that are affordable. I have a tin and aluminum fabricator that does meticulous work. If it’s simply a matter of getting him a ‘63 hood, grill braces and ‘63 ‘09 shroud to use as patterns then that will be certainly do-able.
PM me and I’ll forward an email to send pics to. Thanks in advance
Floyd Horton
Well Known Member
I have a Chrysler 8 3/4 rear end housing that I got from Phil. He said it was removed from the Terry Prince car when it was restored.
409Kid
Well Known Member
Today I ran down a couple of leads. First I received a callback from Cheryl Bader- (?). Forgot her married name at the moment. She is the daughter of Bill Bader and worked at her dad’s dealership when Jack owned the car. Turns out Jack was an employee at Bader Chevrolet during that time. He was the engine builder and dyno tuner in house. Bader apparently sold a lot of high performance parts and Chevy’s back then. Cheryl had two brothers which also worked at the dealership. Bill and one of the brothers are now deceased. Cheryl is 80 years young and is a delight to talk with. She also owns her own Chevrolet dealership in Lompoc CA and is there most everyday. Her brothers took over the Fontana dealership when their dad retired moving the dealership to several locations before eventually retiring and selling it to new owners. She doesn’t have any memorabilia from her dad’s dealership or additional info about Jack’s car other than to say she knew the car well. She is in her words, “Chevrolet all the way!” And has always been high performance oriented. I suspect she has a stable of collector high performance Chevys squirreled away. She is very interested in my project and wants to be kept in the loop as to what I come up with in my research and quests.
She did give me the number for her surviving brother and another person who worked at the dealership. I talked to the latter briefly but he didn’t have anything to offer, but took my number just in case he finds additional info from friends or through the grapevine. The brother doesn’t have voicemail setup on his phone so I’ll continue to try and reach out to him.
She did give me the number for her surviving brother and another person who worked at the dealership. I talked to the latter briefly but he didn’t have anything to offer, but took my number just in case he finds additional info from friends or through the grapevine. The brother doesn’t have voicemail setup on his phone so I’ll continue to try and reach out to him.