General opinion

[Murphdog]

Looking for opinions.
You have a 63 or 64 full size Chevy any model and the VIN tag says it is a 6 cylinder car. You are planning on putting a 409 in it. You have the opportunity to buy a QA or QB engine assembly that is build dated 4-5 weeks before your car was built. Remember the vin on the block & car will not match. The VIN says it is a 6 cylinder car and you cannot change that. Would you pay a premium price for said engine since the dates fit so perfectly. Or just make it look correct since you cannot change the vin. Not trying to pull a fast one, just want it to be a nice car that looks the part. Since it is a 6 cylinder vin I personally think a "correct dated" engine would not add any value to the car.
Jeff

 

[327]

I agree Murphdog , Make it the way you want it. My car was originally a 283 V8. Back in 2009 I changed it to a '64 300 horse 327.

 

[WENGINE]

I agree with you, it would be nice but you wouldn’t be fooling anyone who’s looking including yourself. Just no point to it

 

[MRHP]

Dated would not concern me being an original 6 cylinder car. Just make it how you want it.

 

[63 dream'n]

I think the people who look for that date are doing it for themselves, to make it a semi numbers matching car …….but that’s something it’ll never be…if the car was a highly coveted Corvette with a six cylinder (53) in it, I could see why you would wanna stay with a six cylinder because that will bring more money ……. but our cars unfortunately are not as valuable as some of the other collector cars therefore it really doesn’t matter…… you’ll never get The 25% or whatever it is that they want to attach to an original Car for a 409 ……..yet to someone else who might possibly want the car somewhere down the road, it is more desirable no doubt……. with that 409….. do it for yourself

 

[MRHP]

Mine was born a 380 horse 409, but had a 65 400 horse 409 in it when I bought it. Was cheap enough at the time, and I did not care if the original engine was gone. I paid accordingly and we were both happy. I am not a numbers guy, but I can appreciate them. I am more of a day two type of guy. Run it, and run it hard.

 

[IMBVSUR?]

Looking for opinions.
Would you pay a premium price for said engine since the dates fit so perfectly.
Jeff

No. Your not trying to fool anyone, it doesn't matter, and a few changes makes them all look the same, so why spend money you don't need to when it can be spent elsewhere on the project. But it would be nice to have a correct engine for what it could have had if the price was right, not Premium.

 

[La Hot Rods]

I wouldn't pay extra for more date correct engine. I would buy it if it was a fair deal.

 

[Murphdog]

So that opens up a barrel of snakes. What do you think a good rebuildable 425 hp QB engine is worth. ALL date matched, block, heads intake & exhaust manifolds, correct numbered & dated carbs, correct distributor. NO air cleaner. Just asking!
Jeff

 

[63 dream'n]

first the person who would be selling a QA or QB block that is 100% numbers matching is gonna wanna sell to that person who has a car that that motor would pre-date 3 to 4 months in advance so that they could make their car a numbers matching car therefore they would ask more money for it……… and people are deceitful there’s no doubt about it there are more 409 62 Belair‘s today then Chevrolet ever produced and if they deck the block the evidence is gone but if you have a chance to buy a numbers Matching motor for a decent price it’s definitely worth grabbing I’m not a restoreor a preservation nut but I can appreciate 100 point restoration just not for me ……you surely wouldn’t want to drive something like that then, the whole reason you own the car the point is mute your devaluing the car by driving it…….And taking a chance with your investment…… doesn’t that sound like fun………

 

[La Hot Rods]

5 grand

 

[Iowa 409 Guy]

Put a 6 banger in in and I'll take that bucket of....409...thing off your hands for cheap.

You shouldn't be seen with it.

 

[1964SuperStocker]

Put a 6 banger in in and I'll take that bucket of....409...thing off your hands for cheap.

You shouldn't be seen with it.

Dave will pull that engine apart just to hide it in an oil drum. The guys are right though, don't pay extra for a date. The vin will tell the story for anyone that is interested in the car. Whether they were made around the same time is not a selling point.

 

[63impaloligist]

Verne Frantz once told me that the only things that tell you it's a real 409 car are, a window sticker, build sheet or some other pedigree documentation. Because the trim tag doesn't and the blocks can be re-stamped. Other parts can be aftermarket or used, don't matter. But make yourself happy. They'll never know at the car show or racetrack, if that's your thing. Go with the more cost effective engine. LA Hot Rods is right on price. Our desire pushes the price of this stuff out of range.

 

[Murphdog]

5 grand

In this particular case you can double that.

Verne Frantz once told me that the only things that tell you it's a real 409 car are, a window sticker, build sheet or some other pedigree documentation. Because the trim tag doesn't and the blocks can be re-stamped. Other parts can be aftermarket or used, don't matter. But make yourself happy. They'll never know at the car show or racetrack, if that's your thing. Go with the more cost effective engine. LA Hot Rods is right on price. Our desire pushes the price of this stuff out of range.

I would agree with Verne. Wish I could have had the privilege to speak with him. In this case the casting #'s & dates on the engine assembly match each other and would be correct for the car and the build/assembly date on the vin pad of the block pre dates the build date of the car 4-5 weeks.
But it's still an original 6 cylinder car!
Jeff

 

[Carl 1962]

In 63/64 there was no way to tell which engine a car was originally fitted with from the cowl trim tag, but you can tell engine from the cowl tag on most 60/61 and one plant in 62. Verne and I collaborated on a lot of his research and he eventually agreed, not long before he passed away, that some codes on 60/61/62 do confirm engine size. I took me over 10 years to confirm these codes.

 

[427John]

I don't think date codes mean much unless someone is trying to make it appear to be something its not. Either the block VIN matches the car or it doesn't. Strangely kind of the opposite scenario is present when dealing with early 60's Fords, they didn't start stamping a partial VIN on Ford blocks until 67 or 68 but the car VIN had an engine code that ID the originally installed engine type so say you had a 64 R code car (427 8V) that had a block that had appropriate date codes and casting numbers it is considered correct since there is absolutely no way of telling if it is the original block. Because of that guys have now gotten to where they search for a block that has appropriate date codes for a post 67 or 68 car even though it has the wrong VIN stamped on and is obviously not the original block. Now date codes could be meaningful if you had the original block and needed things like heads, intake, or exhaust manifolds to complete it since they don't have VIN stamps,but otherwise they wouldn't mean much to me and surely wouldn't add any value.

 

[Mr. Chev]

My 61 was a 6 cyl glide car, I wanted a 348 4 spd and was happy to find by fluke a complete 61 350 hp 348 all numbers match with 4 spd and shifter, Not trying to fool anyone but did want a correct engine for the car. Paid 5000 canadian for the engine and trans assembly, had to do heads on 348 and rebuild trans, but am satisfied with it and now have big block 4 spd. Canadian cars cant be faked I dont think because canada keeps records of all cars from new, you can find out all options and dealer where sold, I could be mistaken but have sent in and got back stuff for other cars. Maybe another Canadian can chime in.

 

[327]

My 1962 Impala was built in Oshawa, Ontario. Here is some information that they sent me.

Number produced for sale in Canada ( Same Model No. Only ) 3,242

Option Information Not Recorded For 1962 Chevrolet.

 

[our1962]

63 Biscayne 6 cylinder VIN 1111 now a 409/400hp tremec 6 speed still 6 cylinder VIN

I enjoy the car and everyone that knows what a 409 is does too