Is this a real 409 Shroud?

[mpris]

Every mark which is identifiable on the shroud in question is in exactly the same place as my 64 shroud. From looking at that one picture it is an exact match for mine. If it is a reproduction or a modified shroud it must have been done by the same guy that made them at the factory.

Poocho

 

[real61ss]

mpris,
So, your 64 fan shroud has the big ridges like the one in question has, this is what I was getting at, apparently it fits a '64 only. (it's not like the 61,2 or 3)
I'm not familiar with the '64 409's, I guess the fan shroud in question is only correct for a '64 409 which being the last full year of production for the 409, they might be pretty hard to come by.

 

[mpris]

Well Tommy, since you mention it, I looked at the shroud in question and looked at mine probably 10 times and it always looked the same to me. However, when you mentioned the big ridges, I looked again and realized what you were talking about. I guess you are talking about the two tubular round ridges going around the shroud. Now that I have looked at that particular thing, you are absolutely correct. The middles round ridge is a different size than the one closest to the engine. On my shroud they are exactly the same size. Enclosed is a picture of my shroud from the drivers side. As you can see the ridges are exactly the same size. When compared to the shroud in question, there is no doubt that it is not for a 64 409, as a matter of fact it looks exactly like the photo of the small block shroud in your response which had the pictures with a couple of inches missing. That is unless someone stole mine and replaced it without me knowing about it.

Thanks for keeping me straight.

Poocho

 

[CDNpontiac409guy]

Poocho...
And THERE you have a 1963 fan shroud.

The one on eBay, while not worth $600+... it IS a REAL genuine 1964 Chevrolet / CDN Pontiac 409 fan shroud, that I would have gladly paid $250 for....
but that's all.

 

[real61ss]

mpris,
Your shroud is exactly like the one on my 61 348 and the one on my 63 409 and the one in the second photo that I posted. I believe the one on Ebay was a cut down small block shroud for a 62 thru 64. But, I may be wrong

 

[real61ss]

Aubrey,
After reading your post, you have answered my question, it's a 64 409 shroud which is a one year only part. Right?
And that explains why somebody wanted it so bad.

 

[wrench]

shrouded

Hmmm.....I cannot find my third fan shroud. Perhaps the guy I sold the 409 to got it in the deal....I don't remember. The fourth which was supposed to still be on an extra complete 62 Belair front end I have in the back yard is NOT on it. Gotta figure that out!

But, on my 62 Belair Sport Coupe, I have the fan shroud that is for a small block. The two large ridges are angular. Guaranteed small block. The car had a front end replaced in it's history and has had 15 different engines in the bay before I got it.

Now in the trunk, I have a fan shroud with two rounded ridges. That's the correct for my 62, right?

So as I understand the subject now, the 64 409 fan shroud has the angular ridge shape but has one ridge instead of two? The factory engineered a trimmed small block shroud instead of making a special 409 shroud in 64?

All this time I thought the only difference was the mounting hole bracket issue.

I apologize if my comments were out of place.

 

[wrench]

still shrouded

After going thru my photo database, I find that there are fan shrouds of both designs on use in multiple years of 409 cars. Be it by design or mistake or lack of available parts, there are some real strange fan shroud/year combos out there. A real mix of both types and 61~64 models.

Anyone know a real car show judge who can clear it up?

:

 

[4onthefloor]

If anyone hears of a 64 409 shroud let me know...I need one soon.

 

[CDNpontiac409guy]

Nothing strange, Wrench...

59-61 small block.... "small bumps"... long... 6 mounting bolts

59-60 348... same "small bumps"... about 1 3/4" shorter... 6 mounting bolts

61 348 / 409... same "small bumps"... about 1 3/4" shorter... however, if in conjunction with the newer style "slanted, wide upper rad tank", it will have a bit of extra clearance at the top, against the rad.... 6 mounting bolts

61-63 409... same "small bumps"... about 1 3/4" shorter... extra clearance at the top, against the rad.... 6 mounting bolts

62-63 small block... "big bumps"... long... 6 mounting bolts

64 small block... "big bumps".... long... 4 mounting bolts

64 409... "big bumps"... about 1 3/4" shorter.... 4 mounting bolts.

That's all there is ( I suppose that Is enough, isn't it:eek: )

 

[mpris]

Aubrey, my car is a 64ss 409/425 which I bought new. The shroud is exactly like it was when I bought the car. So it's for sure that all 64s did not have a shroud like the one in question. There may have been a change during the '64 model year to the shroud in question. My car was built in October of '63, so that may be the reason for the type shroud it came with. Is there a part number on those shrouds somewhere?
Tommy, I believe the shroud in my 64 picture is wider than the shroud in your second picture. Notice the distance between the ridge closest to the radiator and the mounting brace where it is welded to the actual shroud. There is at least another inch between the two on my shroud.

Poocho

 

[bobs409]

Well, I'm completely confused now.

When you guys get done hammering this out, let me know the end results.

I always wanted to know the details on these but it sure sounds confusing. I don't have ANY shrouds to look at in person except for the 6/small block shroud that my 63 has.

 

[CDNpontiac409guy]

Well, I'm completely confused now.

QUOTE]

I'm with Bob:

Now I too am confused

Oct 63 ? .... Yes, I suppose that could explain the 63 shroud on your car, Poocho.

Maybe it was a running change that occured at about the same time as the 583 heads and Z11 cam profile which came out mid/late November ?

All 3 1964 409 cars that I have here, were all built after November, 63....
Dec 10, Dec 20 of 63, & Feb 28, 64

 

[jester]

I vote small block

Or, it could be a cut down small block scroud.
Either way, There is no way in he** that anyone should pay that much for a part that does not have a part number on it and even the experts here can't agree is genuine.
"A fool and his money are soon parted"

 

[Old School]

What's Wrong with this picture?

What’s wrong with this picture?

Here's another 1964 SS 409 car advertised on eBay ( Item number: 4599984935) as an original "numbers matching" car. This shroud looks like an uncut small block and the small radiator. Any other tell-tale signs this is a made up car??

 

[Ronnie Russell]

Push on oil filler cap? Aftermarker air cleaner. No pcv valve? 64 valve covers dont have plug wire provisions? Numbers matching? Nope.......

 

[MK IISS]

The seller forgot to mention the car has suffered collision damage. Note the right front fender and hood .

 

[jester]

I didn't know that rubber fuel line from the pump to the carb. was a factory item.

 

[Skip FIx]

My 64 Impala SS 340 hp 409 I bought in 1970 had a push on breather on the fill tube, My dual quad manifold also came with a push on. Maybe swapped before I got it. But then I was more interested in going fast and not factory either.

 

[real61ss]

And that's a small block shroud for sure!!!