409 Hydraulic Lifter, stock Rocker Valve lash Adjustment

[Iowa409]

Most of my small block builds use a solid lifter, and adjust with feeler gauge no problems.

This 409 with hydraulic lifters and fixed push rod tubes, solid tappet cam is a little different, you almost need touch and feel prior experience, (lacking that)

So I looked at a crap load of You Tube video, but it does not and cannot tell you what to feel for, need some old school help here.

My interpretation is this:

Going to go through two complete revolutions of the Crank for sure. but as I tighten the nut on the rocker, I am tightening until I get slight drag on the left/right/spin of the tube, some say that is wrong, you do not care about friction as much as up/down free play at the rocker/valve location.

Some say when there is no up/down that's zero lash, some say when it barely spins while correctly seated in the the cups of the rocker and lifter.

My lifters were not pre-soaked so I can truly depress the springs in the lifter, not the valve, After I have made one full revolution of the crank and I am adjusting them accordingly, but I notice some now have no movement now, and the fear is obviously bending a push rod (I have spares) so does that mean as I turn the crank 90 degrees at a time and I find some push rods that will now NOT spin, I need to back those off, or is that the idea to get them where they are bound with no spinning?

What is a proven method on these 409's

appreciate the help as usual, thank you.

 

[64ss409]

I know everyone has their own preferred way of setting them. Here is the way I have done it for years. This is for hydraulic cams only.
I turn the engine so the timing mark is on 0. It doesn't matter if it's on #1 or #6. I start with #1 cyl and work CCW around the engine. I tighten down the rocker nut feeling up and down motion on the pushrod. When motion is nearly gone, I rotate until I feel a very slight drag on the pushrod and quit. I do this with all 16 rockers going ccw around the engine. Yes, half will be on the lobe and are not set, I will get to that. Now turn the crank 1 turn and set timing mark back on 0. Now starting again with #1 and working around the engine ccw, set ONLY THE LOOSE ONES. Do not re-adjust any tight ones. I go around all 16 valves the 2nd time. Now they are all set at 0 lash. I again start with #1, going ccw around the engine, and give them all 1/2 turn.
Going ccw is just a habit I got into so I don't get mixed up. I do this on all Chevy V8's. I guess it would work on other brands, but I only work on Chevys.

 

[Iowa409]

Thanks Ron, thats almost word for word what Don had said to me, I am doing something very similar, but making two full revolutions of the crank and rechecking adjustment at every 90 degree turn, but your explanation cleared up about not loosening the already adjusted valves, that are on the lobe and fitting tighter, thank you.

 

[Skip FIx]

I do each cylinder separately-like I do solids. That way I do not forget one! Set intake when exhaust just starts to move, exhaust when intake seats. Spin the pushrod, feel the rocker for slack to get to zero lash then depending on the lifter type and their recommendations tighten down and then lock down the poly lock. Comp has some zero lash racing hydraulics(better retainer clip) Most want 1/2-3/4 a turn. Some want a certain amount of preload (0.050) and ten you can do the math on fine threads and how many turns. Rhoads lifters pump down easily(their design) and wil feel loose the second go round even when set correctly.

 

[oldskydog]

 

[tenxal]

-Rotate engine to #1 TDC: adjust #1 ex & int, #3 ex, #5 int, #7 int, #2 int, #4 ex, #8 ex
-Rotate to #6 TDC: adjust #3 int, #5 ex, #7 ex, #2 ex, #4 int, #6 int & ex, #8 int

 

[64ss409]

180 won't get you to #6, gotta go 360.

 

[Iowa409]

Guys that seems to be the most recognized way to adjust them. I think after playing with them for two days I am going to back them all off and try that route. I agree you would have to go 360 to get to #6 tdc. I have tried every which way so I have really got to know my pistons and rotating assy lol. But like relatives who come to visit. Our time has come where I got to move on lol.

Thanks guys

 

[Iowa409]

The nice thing is. My rotating assy does rotate now!!!

 

[El Rat]

After the valves are set I always back off of the poly lock a bit and run the Allen down and then pull the poly lock back where it started.

 

[Iowa409]

working with hydraulic, flat tappet cam, OEM rockers and push rods

 

[Iowa409]

I tried the method up above this morning, I did not like it, when I did the 360Degree rotation the other rockers that I just adjusted got way sloppy and chatty, now my lifters are not pumped up and have never been soaked, so that may have some impact?

I did find right here on this site another method:
http://www.348-409.com/valveadjust.htm under tricks and tips

I am going to try this route with my cam dial wheel tonight.

I know I have done this 5 times now, lol but I'll do it 5 more if it does not feel right to me. (Hard /Headed and stubborn)

 

[Iowa409]

I do feel like I had tried another method of two complete 360 degree revolutions and I am sure I had them way to tight..............

 

[La Hot Rods]

I do each cylinder separately-like I do solids. That way I do not forget one! Set intake when exhaust just starts to move, exhaust when intake seats. Spin the pushrod, feel the rocker for slack to get to zero lash then depending on the lifter type and their recommendations tighten down and then lock down the poly lock. Comp has some zero lash racing hydraulics(better retainer clip) Most want 1/2-3/4 a turn. Some want a certain amount of preload (0.050) and ten you can do the math on fine threads and how many turns. Rhoads lifters pump down easily(their design) and wil feel loose the second go round even when set correctly.

This is the method I use, never fails.

 

[tenxal]

180 won't get you to #6, gotta go 360.

Correct...I have editted my response. Not enough coffee this morning..

 

[427John]

I tried the method up above this morning, I did not like it, when I did the 360Degree rotation the other rockers that I just adjusted got way sloppy and chatty, now my lifters are not pumped up and have never been soaked, so that may have some impact?

I did find right here on this site another method:
http://www.348-409.com/valveadjust.htm under tricks and tips

I am going to try this route with my cam dial wheel tonight.

I know I have done this 5 times now, lol but I'll do it 5 more if it does not feel right to me. (Hard /Headed and stubborn)

Iowa,you may have to do the procedure and then let it sit overnight before you check to see how they feel,rotating it over will collapse the lifters and it may take a while for them to spring back,besides it's always better to have them a little on the loose side rather than too tight,worst case scenario would be you may have to go back and readjust them after you've done your breakin.

 

[Don Jacks]

I make it a practice to go back over the valves after cam break in anyway.I agree with John,a little loose won't hurt anything during cam break in.If you hear a couple of them ticking a bit when running the engine at 2,000-2,500 during break in,just finish the cam break in,then adjust the valves.You have the advantage of having an engine stand.

 

[Iowa409]

Ok I think I have it the way I want it., Movin on

 

[Junky]

You tend to be a little gun shy after a bad and devastating experience. Once you get this one done, your confidence will return, and you will not be second guessing yourself all the time. The correct way to do this is the way that you feel most comfortable with, and that works well for you and the engine.

 

[Iowa 409 Guy]

Ok I think I have it the way I want it., Movin on

It pays to be open minded I'd say. Lot's of ideas on how to do things and there's more than one right way it seems. Lot's of on hand experience here you are drawing from for sure.

It's kinda like me getting advise from Benchrest Hall of Fame shooters about swaging bullets. There are lots of right answers to choose from.